and you cannot stay on Centre Street and say, "I am going to bail you out for bookmaking and not bail you out for narcotics," when National Surety is writing them. They wrote one here the other day, a big one. I mean, you just have to meet competition, and what happened? We stated it was a matter of record. We didn't even write $5,000 bonds for about 3 weeks after this happened, and the company said that unless this fellow was produced, they were not going to write any more narcotic bonds, and they wanted cash and all that. But then what happened, other companies are writing them. There are four surety companies operating in bail bonds right here in New York; and then, of course, you have got hundreds of surety companies throughout the country. Senator DANIEL. Are you now writing them in narcotics cases? Mr. NEWMAN. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Do you consider narcotics violators who have had bonds set up as high as $10,000 or more a greater risk than other types of criminal cases? Mr. NEWMAN. Well, as I say, I haven't had any losses; I get collateral now. I don't write any bonds unless the collateral is there in advance. My company has cut me down on the writing of the size of bonds. In fact, I may have written a couple of bigger bonds here lately, I have had to cut it up with other bondsmen. Senator DANIEL. That is the main thing. The committee is afteras a matter of fact, it has been suggested to this committee that in certain types of cases, in smuggling, there should not be any bonds made possible at all because so many bigtime smugglers just think nothing of leaving a $25,000 or $50,000 bond. Now, you have been in the business for years. Mr. NEWMAN. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. We would just like to have your opinion. Mr. NEWMAN. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Do you think they are a greater risk than other criminal cases? Mr. NEWMAN. Well, I will tell you, I am looking at it from a bondsman's point of view, a bondsman's standpoint. There is no bondsman today can write a bond for anything over $10,000 for narcotics unless he is well, well secured, and by well secured, it would have to be, as a rule, in most instances these people have brothers and their sisters and all that, they come down and put up their homes and, therefore, it is very rarely that these fellows will jump bail; I mean, I would sooner write a bond where a man's mother puts up her house worth $2,000 than a stranger giving me a $5,000 bankroll. Do you follow what I mean? It has worked that way. Now, when you tell me that you have had a forfeiture of that size by that name, you probably know that on authority. I will be truthful with you; I haven't heard of anything like that. Senator DANIEL. You do not feel, then, that they are any greater risk, these narcotics bonds, than these other criminal bonds? Mr. NEWMAN. From past experience they have all shown up; that is the only thing I can say. I can't say anything different. Senator DANIEL. You mean except Bellanca? Mr. NEWMAN. That is right. Senator DANIEL. All right. In spite of your experience with him, that is your opinion? Mr. NEWMAN. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Have you received any part of this $20,000 from any source? Mr. NEWMAN. I have not. Senator DANIEL. Has anyone assured you they will take care of you on it? Mr. NEWMAN. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Any questions, Senator Butler? Mr. Counsel? All right, thank you very much, Mr. Newman. Mr. NEWMAN. Thank you, sir. Senator DANIEL. Mr. Joe Vento. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give to this subcommittee of the Senate Judiciary Committee will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God! Mr. VENTO. I do. TESTIMONY OF JOSEPH VENTO, ENGLEWOOD, N. J. Senator DANIEL. Please be seated, sir. Will you state your full name? Mr. VENTO. Joseph Vento. Senator DANIEL. That is V-e-n-t-o? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Where do you live? Mr. VENTO. 122 Belmont, New Jersey; Belmont Street, Englewood, N. J. Senator DANIEL. Englewood, N. J. What is your age, Mr. Vento? Mr. VENTO. 41. Senator DANIEL. What business are you engaged in at this time! Mr. VENTO. Senator, I refuse to answer any questions; I plead the fifth amendment. Senator DANIEL. How is that? Mr. VENTO. I said I refuse to-I plead the fifth amendment. I refuse to answer any questions that might incriminate me. Senator DANIEL. You understand the question was for you to state to the committee what business you are engaged in at this time? You understood the question? (There was no response from the witness.) Senator DANIEL. I just wanted to be sure you understood the question. We will come to your answer and be sure that we understand that your answer is properly made in the record. Mr. VENTO. Yes. Senator DANIEL. What is that? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. You understand the question? Mr. VENTO. Yes. Senator DANIEL. And your answer is that you decline to answer because of the fifth amendment? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Do you feel that a truthful answer to that question might tend to incriminate you? Mr. VENTO. Yes. Senator DANIEL. Mr. Vento, just for identification purposes, are you the same Joseph Vento who was convicted of a violation of the narcotics law on the 10th of October 1948? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer the question. Senator DANIEL. What? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer the question now. Senator DANIEL. On what ground? Mr. VENTO. That it may incriminate me and disgrace me. Senator DANIEL. Disgrace you? Mr. VENTO. Yes; degrade me. Senator DANIEL. As I understand it-do you have an attorney with you? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. You do not have an attorney. As I understand it, the answer that you give when you say that you decline to answer because you fear it might incriminate you, you mean to stand on the fifth amendment Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Regardless of the manner in which you say it; is that right? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. There may be some of these questions that you can freely answer. I will ask you this one. A further question, whether or not you are the same Joseph Vento who was convicted in 1952 under a charge of conspiracy to violate the narcotics act? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer on my constitutional rights; I refuse to answer. Mr. GASQUE. Mr. Chairman, I should like to suggest that responding to a question as to a matter that is on the records of the court is not a proper subject for a plea of the fifth amendment on his constitutional grounds. Senator DANIEL. Just a moment. Let me confer here with Senator Butler. Have you ever been convicted of a violation of the Federal narcotics laws? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer, on the grounds that it may incriminate me. I stand by the fifth amendment, my constitutional rights. Senator DANIEL. Mr. Vento, it is the opinion of the committee, and the committee's counsel that that question, the last 3 questions for identification purposes, as to whether you are the same person who was named in the indictment and convicted on a certain charge, and whether or not you have ever been convicted of a violation of the Federal narcotics laws are questions to which a truthful answer could not possibly incriminate you and, therefore, the committee orders you to answer at least the last question, whether or not you have ever been convicted of a Federal narcotics charge. Mr. VENTO. It is degrading. Senator DANIEL. What is that? Senator DANIEL. It is degrading? Senator BUTLER. It is no more degrading than the conviction itself; if you are the same fellow you have already been degraded. Senator DANIEL. And if you are not, you certainly can tell us for identification purposes. We would just like to know. Mr. VENTO. Well, I am the same fellow. Senator DANIEL. You are the same fellow, the same person convicted of violation of the narcotics laws in 1948? Senator DANIEL. Speak out so the reporter can hear. Mr. VENTO. Yes. who was Senator DANIEL. Did you plead guilty in either of those cases? Mr. VENTO. Yes. Senator DANIEL. Both? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. You pleaded guilty? Mr. VENTO. Both. Senator DANIEL. Those were charges that you were participating in the narcotics traffic in New York; is that right? Mr. VENTO. I don't remember. Senator DANIEL. In what State? Mr. VENTO. I don't remember. Senator DANIEL. Well, you pleaded guilty to both charges, is that correct? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. Where did you engage in the narcotics traffic? Mr. VENTO. You mean where I pleaded guilty? Senator DANIEL. Where did you plead guilty, first? Mr. VENTO. In New York. Senator DANIEL. In New York; and where did you engage in the narcotics traffic? Mr. VENTO. I don't remember. Senator DANIEL. What? Mr. VENTO. I don't remember. Senator DANIEL. You do not remember where you engaged in the narcotics traffic? Mr. VENTO. No. Senator DANIEL. Well, did you ever engage in the narcotics traffic! Did you ever sell heroin? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever sell-did you say "no"? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever sell any type of narcotic drug to any person? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Well, how did you engage in the narcotics traffic! Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer the question on the groundSenator DANIEL. On the ground that you have previously stated! Mr. VENTO. Yes, under the fifth amendment; I plead the fifth amendment. Senator DANIEL. You have answered that you never did sell any narcotic drugs to any person. You have already said no, that you did not do that. Did you ever give any narcotic drugs to any person? Mr. VENTO. I plead the fifth amendment; I refuse to answer on the ground that it may incriminate me. Senator DANIEL. Do you know Sebastiano Bellanca? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever know a man by the name of Sebas tiano Bellanca? Mr. VENTO. Never heard of him. Senator DANIEL. Never heard of him. Do you know Charles Alba, also known as Charlie Bullets? Senator DANIEL. Did you ever hear of a person by that name? Senator DANIEL. Speak out so the the reporter can hear you. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever know a man by the name of Joseph Gagliano? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Speak out. Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever know a man by the name of Charles Albero, A-1-b-e-r-o. Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever know a person by the name of Cheech Livorsi? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Cheech Livorsi. Did you ever know a man by the name of Eugene Gianini? Senator DANIEL. Have you ever known a man by the name of Anthony Strollo, also known as Tony Benda? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you ever hear of such a person? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. You see, when you just shake your head, the reporter won't get your answer, and I do not hear you, so speak out, please. Do you own the place at which you now live? Mr. VENTO. No, sir. Senator DANIEL. Did you say you lived at 122 Belmont Street, Englewood, N. J.? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. You do not own this house? Mr. VENTO. I refuse to answer that question. Senator DANIEL. On the ground that it might tend to incriminate you? Mr. VENTO. Yes, sir. Senator DANIEL. You just a moment ago said, as I understood it, that you did not own the residence. And I simply wanted to see if I understood you correctly, and then you refused to answer. I am sure that is correct. Senator BUTLER. That is correct. Senator DANIEL. You first said you did not own the house. Let us get it clear you understand that you are under oath, and if you 71515-56-pt. 5—22 |