h. To provide guidance to contracting officers on patent right clauses to be used in research and development contracts, to allocate rights in inventions made under contracts having a deferred patents rights clause, and to determine whether and to what extent contractors shall be required to grant licenses under inventions made in the performance of contracts with the Department.

SECTION 4. DUTIES AND RESPONSIBILITIES.

.01 The Assistant Secretary for Science and Technology shall serve as the principal adviser to the Secretary on all scientific and technological matters related to the physical and natural sciences which are of concern to the Department. In this capacity, he shall serve as adviser to all other Commerce officials with respect to matters involving the physical and natural sciences and related technology, and shall maintain cognizance over all scientific and technological research and development activities in such areas conducted or supported by all organization units of the Department.

.02

a.

In the discharge of his responsibilities, the Assistant Secretary shall:

Coordinate and evaluate existing scientific and technological programs of the Department relating to the physical and natural sciences;

b. Facilitate the expansion of such programs which are considered essential to meeting national needs;

с Develop and assist in the initiation and implementation of new research and development programs in furtherance of the Department's objectives;

d. Represent the Department on the Federal Council for Science and Technology and other policy-level scientific committees and groups; and

e. Coordinate the Department's scientific and technological programs in the physical and natural sciences, and its related research and development activities, with programs of other agencies of the Federal Government and, as appropriate with the activities of State' and local governments, universities, non-profit institutions, and private industry.

SECTION 5. DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY.

The Deputy Assistant Secretary for Science and Technology shall be the principal assistant to the Assistant Secretary for Science and Technology and shall assume full responsibilities for carrying out the functions of the Assistant Secretary during the latter's absence. The Assistant Secretary may delegate his authorities, except the authority to issue or approve regulations, to the Deputy Assistant Secretary for Science and Technology.

SECTION 6. EFFECT ON OTHER ORDERS.

.01

This order supersedes Department Order 177 of April 14, 1966, as amended.

.02 The delegations of authority from the Secretary of Commerce to the Assistant Secretary for Science and Technology, dated July 30, 1962, (27 F.R. 7748-49) are hereby superseded.

Joseph Bautecos

Acting Secretary of Commerce

Senator COTTON. There seems to be on the part of various Members of the Congress, not the Congress as a whole, what would almost appear to be, although I know it is not true, a concerted plan to emasculate the Department of Commerce. A couple of years ago the Department of Transportation was created and that took from the Department of Commerce a good many of its responsibilities.

There is a movement on foot, and I must confess perhaps that I am one of the offenders in this respect, to consider removing the maritime activities and making it once more an independent department. I note that there have been suggestions, and I am not sure there haven't been bills introduced in the House, to try to consolidate in the Government all of the science and technology, the research and development, largely, which involves science and technology, in a new department of its own.

In yesterday's paper I noted that various people under the leadership of Mr. Nader are involved in a crusade to establish a Department of Consumer Affairs.

In many of these projects, if they prove successful, the Department of Commerce will be left in a position of the Standard Oil Co. of New York if someone were to take away all their gasoline stations.

I would like to ask you, and I understand that until you get more accustomed to your duties, more familiar with the problems of the Department, that you wouldn't care to answer these questions that have been advanced, but do you have some general feelings about the feasibility of trying to bunch all the research and development in the Government into one Department?

Dr. TRIBUS. I have some feelings about these things. Just to look at the size of the undertaking, obviously it is not to be decided upon lightly. Therefore, I would rather wait until I have had a chance to be on the job and to study some of the reports that have been generated on this question before volunteering an opinion.

I would say, however, that the concept of putting all of the R. & D. activities of the Government in one agency looks like quite a difficult undertaking.

Senator COTTON. I cannot speak for members of the committee. And, incidentally, there would be more members of the committee here now were it not for the fact that there is a hearing in progress downstairs that has to be attended by a part of the committee. My own feeling, and I suspect most of the committee would agree, is that it would be almost impossible and approach absurdity to try to intermingle basic scientific research with the specialized research, military research and development, with various civil research.

Certainly as a member of another committee on which I serve, which furnishes the money for the National Institutes of Health and for the making of contracts, arrangements with various laboratories, colleges, universities, hospitals, with the amount of medical research it is utterly inconceivable to me that these could be brought under one camp.

I would suspect that that would be your feeling when you have had a chance to view both the forest and the trees as time goes on.

Last year Congress authorized a study called, "The Advantages and Disadvantages of the Increased Use of the Metric System in the United States." I assume that that study will be under your direction. Again, understanding that you may wish to postpone any pronouncement on the subject, do you at present have some inclinations,

ideas, as to the feasibility and the wisdom of seeking to substitute the metric system for the system presently in use?

Dr. TRIBUS. This question has been before the country for a long time. As you know, Senator, it has been discussed for at least 100 years.

The question of the proper balance between the advantages of the metric system and the disadvantages, particularly in the cost of changing over our productive capacity, will determine what we are to do. Until I have had a chance to read the more comprehensive reports, upon which the news stories and the magazine stories that I have seen heretofore have been based, I just don't want to take a position on it.

I consider it an important question. It is one of the challenges that makes this job seem extremely interesting.

Senator COTTON. There have been representatives of various businesses and manufacturing establishments before this committee that, there has been some evidence, bitterly oppose this change. Others have indicated that it would be very costly to them at first, but they indicated that they thought from the longtime standpoint it might later prove advantageous.

Some Members of the Senate are deeply interested in this project. Others are very naturally in doubt.

This committee, after you have gotten to the point where the study is well underway, would wish to consult you again on this matter. I take it you will take the time to see us.

Dr. TRIBUS. Yes, sir.

Senator COTTON. The Marine Sciences Commission recently issued a report recommending the creation of the newly independent Government Agency, to be known as the National Oceanic Atmospheric Agency. Among existing groups opposed to the transfer of this new Agency is ESSA. This is the Environmental Sciences Services Agency, which includes the Weather Bureau, the Coast and Geodetic Survey, also.

Do you have any thoughts about this proposed new agency and about the operations of the Weather Bureau and the Coast and Geodetic Survey, prior to the establishment of the NOAA?

Dr. TRIBUS. That is quite a large issue, sir. I would rather not comment on that in detail until I have had a chance to look into it and get familiar with it.

I think I could say, in general, that in my interviews with Secretary Stans, I gained the impression that he thinks in terms of finding the best way for these organizations to accomplish their missions and if that best way involves being inside or outside of Commerce, that doesn't seem to be the most important issue to him. I feel the same way.

I am not a person who is concerned about building an empire. I am concerned that the right things get done.

Until I have a chance to study what the effectiveness of the Weather Bureau has been, and what impedes its effectiveness, if it is not effective, and until I get a good grip on these questions, I would rather not try to answer them. I don't know whether the Bureau would do a better or worse job in the proposed new situation.

Senator COTTON. As I understand it, the proposal does not necessarily remove it from the Department. It seems to be a matter of

internal organization within the Department. I am not surprised that you would not want to start discussing this subject with the committee

so soon.

This committee authored and sponsored the legislation which you mentioned previously, in the area of flammable standards. Incidentally, this committee is very deeply interested, I think every member of the committee, in the enforcement and the seeking of both voluntary and, if necessary, involuntary cooperation of industry in eliminating as far as possible these hazards.

May we assume that you will give your enthusiastic support, as far as you are able to do so, to carrying out the intent of Congress in regard to this legislation?

Dr. TRIBUS. Yes, sir. I have more than just an official interest in this matter.

As you know, in New Hampshire, in the long winters when everything dries out, we are prone to fires. In the little village of Hanover, we have had several serious fires in the wintertime. I myself had a fire in my home, and replaced all of the kitchen drapes and materials with glass because, as an engineer, I recognized this problem. It is an obvious one.

I have an interest in this question and I certainly will watch over it as well as I can.

Senator COTTON. Under the Fabric Flammability Amendments of 1967 for creating an advisory committee, may we assume that you will, from time to time, if your time permits, be in touch with, and advise this committee of the progress and receive their suggestions? Dr. TRIBUS. Yes, sir. As a matter of fact, I believe very strongly in the use of advisory committees to the Government. I have served in such advisory capacity. Several years ago I appeared before another Senate hearing to urge the development of an advisory committee for another agency.

I think well of the possibility to draw on outside advisers for advice. Senator COTTON. Undoubtedly you are fully aware of the legislation that came out of this committee with regard to Truth in Packaging which I have always though was a misnomer. It was really Truth in Labeling, and provided for encouraging cooperation of industry for a reasonable standard of packaging, which will come under your control.

May we assume that that will receive your attention?

Dr. TRIBUS. Yes, sir.

Senator COTTON. I have just one thing to add, and that is perhaps because I have sat on this committee for many years, almost from the time I first entered the Senate and I am quite sure the chairman of the committee, Senator Manguson, feels the same way we have a particular interest naturally in the Department of Commerce because we are the Commerce Committee. We have the oversight duties over the activities of the Department; we have become somewhat familiar with it, and I question how much detailed knowledge any of us on the Hill have with respect to what goes on in the Departments. I don't want to imply sub rosa improper activities. We naturally don't have knowledge of all the machinery. We are particularly interested in the Department of Commerce.

I, for one, opposed rather mightily the project of the former President Johnson to consolidate Commerce with Labor. I thought it

would be like the lion and the lamb laying down together, and only one of them ever getting up.

I view, and I think other members of the committee view, with some displeasure this constant attempt to move out of the Department of Commerce matters that to us seem to be a part of our commerce and the general development of Commerce, and safeguarding the consumer in his various aspects. We think that is the way it should be. We don't like to see the Commerce become a shell.

You have our best wishes. I hope that you will be able, with your background, your experience, and your expertise in these matters, to help restore, if there has been any loss of prestige, to the Department of Commerce its full activity.

I trust that you realize that challenge and anticipate it.

Dr. TRIBUS. I thank you for those sentiments, sir. I will do my best. Senator COTTON. Thank you, Doctor.

Senator Pearson?

Senator PEARSON. Mr. Chairman, I don't have any questions. I was very interested in the responses made by the dean.

I noted that you have done some work in aeronautics and space research. We think the aviation problems are some of the most difficult we are going to face this year. I am most hopeful you can help us to the extent that the Department of Commerce will be involved in those problems.

I share the chairman's view that the Department is a vital one and an essential one. I think we are very fortunate to have a man of your qualifications. I certainly wish you well. I guess we will be seeing you from time to time up here.

I thank you, sir.

Senator COTTON. Thank you, Senator.

Thank you, Doctor, and good luck to you.

Dr. TRIBUS. Thank you, sir.

Senator COTTON. The committee stands adjourned.

(Whereupon, at 10:12 a.m., the committee was adjourned.)