be penalized under the terms of this bill. Mr. WILLIAMS. Of course they could. As the gentleman knows, there are manufacturers whose products are used exclusively by Negroes in the South. They are manufactured by Negroes, for Negroes.

I doubt if many of our northern or western colleagues ever heard of such a thing as a pomade known as a "hair straightener" or a product known as skin whitener. These products are sold in every little store in the South. They are manufactured by Negroes and sold exclusively to Negroes. Do you want to put them out of business?

Mr. HUDDLESTON. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. WILLIAMS. I yield to the gentleman from Alabama.

Mr. HUDDLESTON. I commend the gentleman from Mississippi for offering this amendment. I have in mind a situation where a theatrical group wants to

put on Shakespeare's great tragedy "Othello." They need a particular type of individual to play the part of Othello. How could that be accomplished unless the gentleman's amendment is adopted? How could they possibly get the type of individual to play that part unless we incorporate the words "race or color" in this section?

Mr. WILLIAMS. I believe there are other plays, such as "Green Pastures" that call for an all Negro cast. Surely producers of these plays should be allowed to advertise for Negro actors.

Mr. HUDDLESTON. We propose in this section to add "national origin,” but how would either "national origin or religion" cover the obtaining of the proper type of person to play the role of Othello in Shakespeare's play?

Mr. WILLIAMS. The gentleman from Alabama has just pointed out another reason why this kind of legislation is wholly impracticable and unworkable.

House 2-8-64 pp. 2553-2555

Mr. ABERNETHY. Mr. Chairman, I move to strike out the last word.

Mr. Chairman and Members of the House, I would like to propound a question or two to the chairman of the committee, the gentleman from New York [Mr. CELLER or to the gentleman from Ohio Mr. MCCULLOCH].

If this bill becomes law, would it be within the law for a political party to appeal to a group for their vote on the ground of race? Would that be permissible?

Mr. CELLER. I do not think it has anything to do with a situation like that. Mr. ABERNETHY. Then, as I understand you, the parties could make an appeal to the voters on the ground of race?

Mr. CELLER. This does not cover political parties.

Mr. ABERNETHY. I did not ask that. I asked if it would be within the law.

Mr., CELLER. No, it would not. It would have nothing to do with it.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Then, they could not appeal to people for their vote on the grounds of race?

Mr. CELLER. This bill has nothing to do with that.

Mr. ABERNETHY. It does not?

Mr. CELLER. No.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Why was that excepted from the bill?

Mr. CELLER. We cannot cover the waterfront and do everything with a bill like this.

Mr. ABERNETHY. How would the gentleman feel about an amendment of that kind?

Mr. CELLER. I do not think an amendment like that would be germane or within the orbit or should be within the orbit of this bill.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Do you think such should have the consideration of Congress?

Mr. CELLER. I think that is another matter and some other committee might handle that.

Mr. ABERNETHY. I will ask another question. If it should be illegal-and I understand it would be under this billfor an employer not to hire a person on the ground of race-that is, color-would it be illegal not to hire because of the shade of color, that is because the skin of the applicant is too dark?

Mr. CELLER. I suppose shade of color would be color. The whole embraces all its parts.

Mr. ABERNETHY.

I have in mind a certain series of articles here.

Mr. CELLER. Of course, this would all have to be tested out eventually in the courts.

Mr. ABERNETHY. I have here a collection of articles published about 3 years ago by the Washington Star entitled "The Negro in Washington." The publication is in 14 or 15 sections. These articles were done by a gentleman from the chairman's State of New York by the name of Haynes Johnson, a young man of about 30 years of age. He is the son of one Malcolm Johnson, a 1949 Pulitzer Prize-winning member of the staff of the old New York Sun.

Article No. 5, which I will get permission to insert into the RECORD, carried distinct statements and charges by Negro citizens of the District of Columbia of dark shade that they were being discriminated against by Negroes of lighter shade, and that the discrimination was because the former were too black, or too Negroid.

This young writer went over the District seeking information from and asking questions of the colored people on this specific subject. Here are some of the questions and answers and reports he included in his article.

A Negro businessman of dark color in the District said:

We are confronted with an entirely new type of opposition from a group which mistakenly identifies itself as "the new Negro❞—

The Negro merchant defined this kind of person as the

self-efficient, arrogant, smug and underexposed individual who feels he has arrived. His basic shortcoming lies in his desire to disassociate

A new word for "segregate"

from the Negro who has not reached the stage of the "new Negro❞—

Continuing

"disassociate" and his failure to share his knowledge with people of his own race, who he feels are not up to standards that he now knows.

Continuing further from this article: A Negro sociologist tells about talking to a woman in this economic and social group

The CHAIRMAN. The time of the gentleman from Mississippi [Mr. ABERNETHY] has expired.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to proceed for 5 additional minutes.

The CHAIRMAN. Is there objection to the request of the gentleman from Mississippi?

There was no objection.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Continuingwho had watched Louis Armstrong on television the night before.

"Wasn't that terrible?" she said. I said, "No. Why?"

She said, "Oh, you know, he doesn't look right." She meant he was too black.

At another point we find the following:

At Howard University one student has several charcoal sketches of Negroes on his dormitory wall. They portray Negro men and women with prominent negroid features. "You see those," the student said, pointing to the wall. "You know what many of the boys say when they see them? They say, "Oh, those are terrible." They mean they're too negroid.

That lays the groundwork for the rest of the article. The article goes on to charge discrimination by these Negro people of light shade, light pigment, who "have arrived," as they describe themselves. They discriminate against others of their race who have dark skin.

The discrimination is practiced in various ways-housing, seating on buses and so on.

Speaking of the "Gold Coast," which is the 16th Street area, Northwest, inhabited by colored citizens of the District who "have arrived" and whose earnings are in five figures or better per year, one of the "Gold Coast" area said:

Yes, I know that the other Negroes call this the Gold Coast.

This is one of the "Gold Coasters" speaking:

There are some who call this the Negro's Spring Valley.

"Well, since this is the best area that's the reason we guard it just as jealously as they do in Spring Valley or Wesley Heights. We're not snobbish. That's not it. But look at it this way: Why put a big price on a

home if you're going to allow the neighborhood to deteriorate?

He goes on to observe that they want to keep it from being "integrated" by the Negroes who have more distinctive negroid characteristics, which means there is a housing discrimination on the Gold Coast. Negroes of dark skin up there. The article proceeds to tell about one particular Negro moving in who was disliked and not wanted because he was black, a poor dresser, and just not suited to the neighborhood.

They do not want any

Now, this further quotation from the article:

"Certainly there's a difference among Negroes. It's not snobbery, but let's face it, if a person isn't of the same background as you, you don't even get anything out of a conversation with him.

"I've sat down next to some of my people on the streetcar, and frankly I don't relish it. When you come down to it I'm segregated."

This is not a southern white man talking. It is a Washington Negro, who says he is for segregation among Negroes. And I, for one, respect his right to segregate to choose his own friends and associates, and even who he shall sit by on a bus.

Let us repeat:

I guess we just consider ourselves better than others.

And listen to this:

When you come down to it, we are just segregated.

Now, I would like to ask the chairman this question: Would the FEPC have authority to correct an employment discrimination among our Negro citizens in the District of Columbia, where lightskinned Negroes refuse to hire Negroes of dark skin?

Mr. CELLER. The gentleman read a lot which has involved personal opinions of certain individuals of the Negro race which have nothing to do with this bill. I may say if there is any discrimination against the Negro regardless of his shade or gradation of pigmentation of his skin in employment, that discrimination would be a violation of this act.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Do you have an FEPC in New York?

Mr. CELLER. Yes.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Have you had any cases before the Commission in this category?

Mr. CELLER. I am not familiar with that, but the gentleman from New York might give you information.

Mr. GOODELL. I am not aware that any cases have been raised on that point.

Mr. ABERNETHY. Then the discrimination of light-skin Negroes against those of dark skin prevails only in the District of Columbia? This I cannot and do not believe. It is a well-known fact that the discrimination within the Negro race, as referred to in this article, exists in every city. All one need do to detect it is to open his eyes.

Mr. ROOSEVELT. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. ABERNETHY. I yield to the gentleman from California.

Mr. ROOSEVELT. There have been no such cases in California.

Mr. ABERNETHY. I will ask the gentleman from California if he thinks this FEPC would cover employment practices in this respect?

Mr. ROOSEVELT. I agree entirely with what the chairman of the Committee on the Judiciary said.

Mr. CELLER. I may say to the gentleman, if there is discrimination against any Negro and the discrimination is directed against the Negro by either a white man or Negro, there would be a violation.

Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. ABERNETHY. I yield to the gentleman from Mississippi.

Mr. WILLIAMS. I would hope that the gentleman might add to the question asked the gentleman from California, in that he represents the general area of the movie colony, if without my amendment a movie concern wanting to make a picture which has its setting in Africa would be permitted to advertise for several hundred Negro extras to play in the picture?

Mr. ROOSEVELT. I do not represent the movie industry. I represent a little bit of it. My friend, the gentleman from California [Mr. CORMAN] represents an equal part, and the gentleman from California [Mr. BELL] also. But in direct answer to the question as the gentleman put it, it would seem to me that it would be a proper reason to plan such an advertisement if it was not stated or intimated that only Negroes will play the parts. We in California know this is not necessary.

Mr. WILLIAMS. Yes, with my amendment.

Mr. ROOSEVELT. Without your amendment it would be. I am opposed to the gentleman's amendment.

Mr. WILLIAMS.

According to the bill the only loophole in this is that they can discriminate on the ground of religion when that is a bona fide qualification for employment and with the amendment offered by the gentleman from New York they would extend that to national origin, whenever that is a bona fide occupational qualification. My amendment would extend this to race and color so that they would also be excepted when it is a bona fide occupational qualification.

Mr. ABERNETHY. The article from which I read reveals a type of discrimination which the proponents of this bill and the Negro associations never mention. And it is one which their own little FEPC's never dare attack. By their own admissions, the State units of the FEPC have dared not move against such. Why? Because it is the philosophy of the proponents of this bill that Negroes, whether of light or dark skin, can discriminate against each other; but if a genuine white man is involved in such, then he must desist or go to jail. The double standard clearly exists.

The article from which I read in part is as follows:

THE NEGRO IN WASHINGTON

(By Haynes Johnson)

The Negro at the lowest level of income and education feels cut off not only from society but from many within his own race. He is the true outsider in Washington. He believes that those in his race who hold good jobs and live in decent homes have turned their backs on him. He and thousands like him comprise what is for want of a better term-the lower class of Negroes.

That the Negro has distinct classes with all of the accompanying friction and antagonism, that the word implies, should come as no surprise. There are class structures in all groups. Within the Negro population, however, the classes are particularly complicated.

"There is a group within our race-they call themselves the educated group or the upper crust-and they feel they are better than the rest of us." a Government worker said. "They actually build barriers within our own race."

What are these barriers?

One of the most important is also the most subtle. It has to do with the word Negro itself and what that word means.

"You'll meet many people in Washington who will not use the word 'Negro.' a distinguished Negro educator said. "It's a bad word. So many painful memories are associated with it. They might say colored, but they might not even say that. They almost try to deny such a race exists. Those scars are part of the experience of the Negro."

Some Negroes will argue there are middleand upper-class groups that are divorced These from the problems of their race. people live in good homes, insulated by their own small social groups. They are not fighting for their race. They are afraid of anything which might upset their status.

"You see," a young Negro minister said, "when you reach the plateau of the middle class, you don't want to rock the boat, you don't want to disturb the situation, especially once you're looked on as a socially desirable class.

"Until the middle and the upper classes realize that what happens to the lower classes affects them, too, no matter how much money or status they have, you aren't really going to be able to solve the problem from

within.

"They're out of contact with the other groups," he said. "They don't have to come home to one room and not know where the next meal is coming from. They don't really feel these things, and so they don't understand."

Is this true? Negroes who have studied the problem say it is. This reporter can only say he has been in some homes where it appears to be true. In fairness, though, this has not been a common experience.

The Negro intellectual is especially concerned about this problem. He will say that often Negroes who have risen to five-figure Incomes-and there are many in this category in Washington-seem to wish to disassociate from the race. They even look down on Negro folk music and literature.

"It

A Negro scholar says this reflects an attitude of "second generation respectability." "I think it's a weakness," he said. tends to break down the connection betweeen the educated and the lower groups. Bessie Smith, Mahalia Jackson. people like that are honored in the community for their way of singing. The people understand it. It's a part of their culture. Why should it be denied? "There's too much hypersensitivity about too many things."

A businessman said, "We are confronted with an entirely new type of opposition from a group which mistakenly identifies itself as 'the new Negro.''

He defined this kind of person as "the self-efficient, arrogant, smug and underexposed individual who feels he has arrived."

"His basic shortcoming lies in his desire to 'disassociate' and his failure to share the knowledge with people of his own race, who he feels are not up to standards that he now knows."

A Negro theologist tells about talking to a woman in this economic and social group who had watched Louis Armstrong on television the night before.

"Wasn't that terrible?" she said. I said, "No Why?"

"She said: 'Oh, you know, he doesn't look right. She meant he was too black. Then I said: 'I think he's an artist and we should be proud of him.' She thought they should have got someone else."

At Howard University one student has several charcoal sketches of Negroes on his dormitory wall. They portray Negro men and women with prominent Negroid features.

"You see those," the student said, pointing to the wall. "You know what many of the boys say when they see them? They say, 'Oh, those are terrible.' They mean they're too Negroid. I keep them there as my private forms of psychoanalysis for the others." These attitudes still are factors in the colored classes in Washington (although their importance has diminished greatly in recent years).

INTEGRATION WITHIN RACE

That's what a colored man meant when he said. "The Negroes in Washington had to do their own integrating after 1954."

At one time the shade of a man's skin played a significant role among the Negro population in the Capital. (This was 8 heritage from slavery days, when the lightskinned Negro was given advantages over the man with a darker skin.)

"I think today there is a little less emphasis on color among Negroes," a businessman who was born and educated in Washington said. "But it's hard to change the habit of years of tradition.

"Back in the old days the Negro developed what I'm sure you heard of as a bastard aristocracy. My own father was a mulatto, for instance, and lived in a certain class.

"Color became almost a caste, both economically and socially. To be a mulatto almost always identified you with a powerful white family. Those children had more opportunities. They were sent away to school and formed their own societies in the Northern cities.

"Usually they intermarried with each other to maintain the masquerade. Some of them were able to pass for whites. It meant, of course, they had more advantages. This is not so true today. But it is true that many of the really old Washington families actually resented integration. To put it personally, my mother was one of those. She's rather stiff-necked about it."

MONEY, EDUCATION THE KEY

Who are these people in the better classes? They are the same as in any group. Status 18 determined by money and education. At the top are the professional groups, the doctors, lawyers, teachers, businessmen, and high-ranking Government employees.

In the middle is a large group of Government workers, merchants and ministers. In many of these families the wife works and the husband has a second job so they can buy a home in a decent section. At the bottom are the unskilled laborers.

"I think your slum dwellers today are very sharply divided from your bourgeoisie,"

a scholar said. "Your professional groups have more cliques. There is your clash today-between the laborers and recent migrants from the South and the Washington middle class."

Expressing it another way, it's the old story that "the lower classes are jealous." And well they might be.

DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA BEST FOR NEGRO Negroes will tell you with justifiable pride that "this city has a better standard of living from the Negro point of view than any other city in the United States or in the world, for that matter."

In the higher brackets, the Negro in Washington may earn up to $100.000 a year, a Negro businessman said. For those who have been able to take advantage of the opportunities here, the material rewards are visible.

The most striking is the neighborhood where the wealthiest Negroes live in the far Northwest off 16th Street near the Carter Barron Amphitheater and Rock Creek Park.

This section is enviously called the "Gold Coast."

"Certain sections seem to denote certain standards," a colored man said. "For instance. I live in Brookland (in Northeast Washington off Rhode Island Avenue) and they will say, 'Oh, you live with the rich Negro.' It's the same way with the 'Gold Coast' where the richest Negroes live."

FEAR DETERIORATION

When the phrase "Gold Coast" was mentioned to a man who lives there, he smiled and said: "Yes, I know that the other Negroes call this the Gold Coast. There are some who call this the Negro's Spring Valley.

"Well, since this is the best area that's the reason we guard it just as jealously as they do in Spring Valley or Wesley Heights. We're not snobbish. That's not it. But look at it this way: Why put a big price on a home if you're going to allow the neighborhood to deteriorate? No, no one up here is snobbish, although I guess there are Negroes in other parts of town who think so."

A housewife on that street told how worried everyone was because "a family who left Southwest because of the redevelopment moved in next to the church on the corner, and we are all quite upset about the appearance of the yard. The man sits out on the porch in his overalls. They are a more rural type of family. Not the way other people here are."

As you go down the economic ladder you will hear similar comments. Here are some:

"Certainly there's a difference among Negroes. It's not snobbery, but let's face it, if a person isn't of the same background as you, you don't even get anything out of a conversation with him. You wouldn't choose that kind of person as a friend or marry that type."