Mr. COHELAN. Mr. Chairman, I think the provisions of the bill that we have proposed and suggested would well take that kind of specific situation into account. The object is, if there is a national need, a determination can be made of what to do, but the emphasis is on trying to preserve our resources. Mr. BARING. In another area, there are areas in your State, for example, where the grass is belly deep for cattle, and it would be a shame that that should go to waste, too, and there could not be any grazing. I believe the higher elevations naturally should have some wilderness set aside. What would you advocate for fire control where there are no roads? Mr. COHELAN. Mr. Chairman, as I understand it, the areas that have been set out will be amply surveyed and there will be appropriate buffer areas, all this being done through the Interior and Agriculture Departments. The proposals, as I understand them, are very modest as far as the lands involved, in terms of total area that we hope to preserve as wilderness. Mr. BARING. In our field hearings at Las Vegas we interviewed about seven different groups who wanted skiing in the San Gorgonio area in California. I think every one of them had a different idea of what we should do. Mr. COHELAN. Mr. Chairman, as you know so well, we are not asking that we do not have recreational areas. All we are addressing ourselves to is a very small percentage of the total amount of the available resources in this country. In this particular area on which we are concentrating our attention, in the great States of California, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington, it is well known there are these very handsome recreational areas that receive a great deal of citizen use. What is proposed here is in no way intended to change that. Mr. BARING. The gentleman from Alaska. Mr. RIVERS. The colloquy between the chairman and the gentleman from California has exhausted what my inquiry would have been. So, I have no further questions. Mr. BARING. The gentleman from Iowa. Mr. KYL. I thank my colleague for being here this morning. I have some very brief questions, and my purpose in asking the questions is simply to try to promote a compromise which we can get to the floor. If we report H.R. 9162 without amendment, will the gentleman from California oppose the bill? Mr. COHELAN. No, Mr. Kyl. As I have indicated in my testimony, I will gladly support the bill, because for many years, as I indicated in my testimony, ever since I came to Congress, I have been urging action in this area. The differences that I call attention to in my testimony I think are rather minor, but nonetheless they are important. The art of the possible is something we well understand, and we would indeed support the legislation, but, hopefully, I would ask the committee to consider these matters which I have brought to your attention this morning. Mr. KYL. I thank the gentleman. That is all, Mr. Chairman. Mr. BARING. The gentleman from California. I welcome my colleague from California this morning. I think he has presented a very comprehensive statement. As he knows, I represent the other side of the area in California, the one which has the historical background, you might say, of our State and has dealt with the mining industry, the lumber industry, and the cattle industry, while at the same time we have a large area that is being developed each year for recreational purposes. Certainly we have set aside some areas as wilderness, wild and primitive, in that area at the present time. Just recently three of those areas have been reclassified and brought into the wilderness status. I think there is room for both, and I think there must be some very careful thinking and work in the preparation of this bill so we all can get along. Certainly, the bills before us today are much different from those which were before us at the last session. Certain compromises have been reached by the various interests. I am sure any bill which will come out of this committee will more or less be a compromise. Our wilderness areas are being used by those who want to use them now and, if set aside for posterity, those in generations to come will be able to use the wilderness area. If one or two that are now classified as primitive come into the system, I think we will have a fair wilderness system throughout at least the area of California I represent, which comprises the largest acreage of wilderness area in the State. Recently, when the High Sierra Primitive Area was brought in, consideration was given to certain types of development related to recreation and higher use by the people. I think that is probably the thinking that will be written into any bill that comes from this committee. Mr. COHELAN. I thank the gentleman. Mr. BARING. The gentleman from Virginia. Mr. MARSH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have no questions. I appreciate the statement made by the gentleman from California. Mr. BARING. Thank you, Mr. Cohelan, for your appearance here this morning. Mr. COHELAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. BARING. Out next witness is our colleague, Albert H. Quie, author of H.R. 3878 and H.R. 9101. STATEMENT OF HON. ALBERT H. QUIE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF MINNESOTA Mr. QUIE. Mr. Chairman, I wish to add my support in favor of the wilderness bill. To lose, through neglect, negligence, or apathy, the natural wilderness and wildlife resources with which we are endowed, means to give up forever a source of enjoyment and benefit for our people. The benefits are not limited to our generation, but will be manifest in generations to come. I have long supported the concepts which are inherent to such legislation. Back on February 18, 1963, I introduced H.R. 3878, a bill to establish a National Wilderness Preservation System for the permanent good of the whole people. On November 7, 1963, the gentleman from Pennsylvania (Mr. Saylor) introduced a bill, H.R. 9070, also for establishment of a National Wilderness Preservation System. I was in agreement with the bill introduced by the gentleman from Pennsylvania and on November 12, 1963, expressed my agreement by introducing another bill, H.R. 9101 identical to his. Since these various bills were introduced, I have received ample evidence of the support for such a measure among conservation and wildlife organizations and in the public at large. For instance, the officers and board members of the Southern Minnesota Sportsman's Club of Rochester, Minn., on behalf of the 400 members of that organization, have written urging passage of such a bill. I have received a joint communication from 14 conservation organizations who had held a joint meeting and voted unanimously a resolution favoring such action in order to preserve vast areas of natural resources in northern Minnesota. That group of organizations included the Izaak Walton League, Minnesota Junior Chamber of Commerce, Minnesota Chapter of the Wildlife Society, the Citizens Committee for Development of Minnesota Natural Resources, Minnesota Conservation Federation, Natural History Society, YMCA, North Star Chapter of the National Campers and Hikers Association, Friends of the Wilderness, Minneapolis Chamber of Commerce Natural Resources Committee, Minneapolis Junior Chamber of Commerce, President's Committee for the Quetico-Superior Area, Nature Conservancy and the National Wildlife Federation. My extensive file on this subject also includes a letter from P. K. Sims, director of the Institute of Technology, School of Earth Sciences at the University of Minnesota. He urges support of a reasonable wilderness bill. The Waseca, Minn., Sportsmen's Club, Inc. supports such legislation as do many members of conservation organizations in my district, as well as many citizens who have indicated their interest and support even though they are not formally members of conservation groups. At this point, I shall share some of these letters with you, for your consideration. Mr. BARING. Without objection, the letters referred to will be made a part of the record at this point. (The letters referred to follow :) Hon. ALBERT H. QUIE, UNIVERSITY OF MINNESOTA, INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY, SCHOOL OF EARTH SCIENCES, U.S. House of Representatives, Washington, D.C. DEAR MR. QUIE: Of the several versions of a wilderness bill now before Congress, I believe that H.R. 9162 is the best for the overall interests of the State of Minnesota. It would preserve certain areas in northeastern Minnesota in their primitive condition and at the same time would allow reasonable opportunity for future mining activities. It would be tragic for the long-range economic welfare of northeastern Minnesota, and the State, should the potentially important copper-nickel deposits in eastern St. Louis County and adjacent Lake County be shut off from future mining. I urge that you support the Dingell bill. Yours sincerely, P. K. SIMS, Director. Hon. ALBERT QUIE, WASECA SPORTSMEN'S CLUB, INC., House of Representatives, Washington, D.C. SIR: I am writing in behalf of the Waseca Sportsmen's Club, whose members wish to urge you to do everything in your power to effect passage of the wilderness bill. We would like to see this passed with the amendments which have been urged by conservation leaders, particularly the amendments which would protect national forest primitive areas, roadless areas in the national park system, and wild life refuges and ranges, unless they were acted upon by Congress. The Senate version of the bill, which I understand has passed, apparently includes most of these amendments. The bill is known as H.R. 9162. Thank you for your cooperation in this matter. Sincerely yours, HOWARD A. SAHLSTROM, Secretary. ROCHESTER, MINN., January 23, 1964. Hon. ALBERT H. QUIE, House of Representatives, Washington, D.C. DEAR MR. QUIE: I am writing this letter in reference to the National Wildlife Preservation System bill, H.R. 9070, presented by Mr. Saylor of Pennsylvania. I would like to encourage your stand on defending this bill as the outcome of it will affect not only this generation, but many generations to come. I feel it would be disastrous if people 30 or 40 years from now would not be able to see and enjoy some of the unspoiled wilderness which encountered their forefathers only 100 years before. The meager income which would be gained from the destruction of these wildernesses is minute in comparison to the amount of enjoyment gained by future generations. We are a prosperous nation and our economy would not be affected one way or another by this decision, therefore monetary reasons would not warrant this destruction. I feel it would be far better for future generations to be able to see bear, deer, and other such forms of wildlife in their natural habitat than to have to go to a zoo because of the selfish greed of a few present-day mercenary personnel. In other words let's live our lives to the fullest, but also look ahead so that future generations might also be able to enjoy their lives to the fullest. Sincerely, BRAD O'GROSKY. ROCHESTER, MINN., April 17, 1964. Congressman ALBERT H. QUIE, House Office Building, Washington, D.C. DEAR MR. QUIE: We, the officers and board members of the Southern Minnesota Sportsman's Club of Rochester and our 400 members, respectfully request your active support on the following House bills. H.R. 9162, the wilderness bill. H.R. 3846, land and water conservation fund. Our club is very much concerned with the legislatlon on these bills and we will appreciate your active support for same. SOUTHERN MINNESOTA SPORTSMAN'S CLUB, B. O. BUSHFORD, JOHN O. HALL, DAVID H. FANNING. Hon. ALBERT H. QUIE, ROCHESTER, MINN., February 21, 1964. House Office Building, Washington, D.O. DEAR MR. QUIE: I would appreciate receiving the recent "1963 Yearbook of Agriculture" if it is available. If there is anything further you could do to promote wilderness bill legislation I would be very grateful. Sincerely, SIDNEY W. MAURER, Jr., M.D. ST. OLAF COLLEGE, DEAR MR. QUIE: As a member of the Wilderness Society I received the enclosed information on the status of wilderness legislation. I am sending it to you in hopes that you can use it. I was happy to see your name as sponsor of a conservation bill. I have known for several years your interest in wilderness preservation and fully back your stand. Thank you for your good work. Sincerely, KENDALL ELLINGSON. P.S.-Norway Valley, near St. Olaf, will become a road in the near future following present administration plans. Heath Creek needs more trees, clean water, more visiting students, and less cultivation, cows, and carelessly thrown beer cans. With these two wilderness areas in your own district being overrun and ruined by civilization, I need not remind you that conservationists must be always alert. MINNEAPOLIS, MINN., Hon. ALBERT QUIE, House of Representatives, Washington, D.C. DEAR SIR: As residents of the State of Minnesota, we urge you as Representative to see that the wilderness bill does not pass without the amendments advocated by the conservation organizations. It would appear imperative that there be definite control on mining, that the status quo of such areas be insured, and that positive machinery be provided for this control, all of which are covered in the amendments. Yours sincerely, Mr. and Mrs. LESTER W. IHDE. NORTHFIELD, MINN., March 17, 1964. Congressman ALBERT QUIE, DEAR MR. QUIE: We have been interested in the wilderness bill, H.R. 9162, known as the Dingell bill. We understand it will be passed this year and hope the amendments advocated by conservation organizations will be included-we urge it. The recommended amendments would make it similar to H.R. 9170, H.R. 9101, and H.R. 9520 which conservation organizations have favored. Thank you for your report just received and all the good work you are doing as our congressman. Sincerely, Mr. and Mr. ALVIN HOUSTON. NORTHFIELD, MINN., March 17, 1964. Hon. ALBERT H. QUIE, MY DEAR MR. QUIE: According to the Minneapolis Tribune of March 15, the wilderness bill, H.R. 9162, is now up before Congress. I am a member of the Wilderness Society and have been interested in conservation measures for many years. I would therefore like to express my wish that this bill, with amendments as advocated by the Wilderness Society and other similar organizations, |