he has some responsibiilty and if you will give him the opportunity and protect him, he will pick his Government up, he will pick his union up.

Why do the American people go to the polls in such numbers to vote? They have a right to. You go to the polls and try to put one out and see what happens. They go to the police, but they do not do that with some these racketeer unions.

Some of them you know about and I do, too. Some of them, if they criticize or object to the activities of the officers of the union, you know what happens. I do, too. For that reason they are not going in there. They are not going in there where there is trouble.

If they can be thrown out or fined $500 or $1,000, and they do do it, and if they do not support who they tell them to support, you know what happens. Those are the things that if restored to the average rank and file union man he will acquit himself in that situation just like the average American citizen does if he gets a Congressman in there that he thinks is a crook and he does not like, he will kick him out and will do it without any fear of reprisal whatever.

Mr. MAHON. Mr. Barden, I would like to make one comment: I am pleased to see that you and other members of this committee and Mr. Pucinski recognize these facts. I want to say, and I think you have seen some demonstration of it today, that if this Congress will make provision for a committee, a place where a local member can come at any time and cite these things to you first-hand, occasionally, I believe it will have a wholesome effect on the labor movement.

That is why we recommend a committee on small unions or local autonomy here in your committee or in the House and Senate.

Chairman BARDEN. That is a good suggestion, Mr. Mahon, but watch out you do not meet yourself coming back down the road because you just told me you do not like this business of being segregated off with little unions and not having the same kind of consideration as the big unions.

Mr. MAHON. Congressman, we are hopeful that that will come about, but I have to harken back to the experience I have had over the past 20 years or so. Until that time comes we would like to know there is a place where we can get some attention in case that does not come about. I hope it does and if it does, perhaps that is the answer to it.

Chairman BARDEN. About every year you will have a place here in this room. I cannot guarantee you any further.

Mr. MAHON. Thank you.

Mr. RYAN. Mr. Mahon, in connection with your statement that you think it is a wholesome thing for a committee to sit here and have the rank and file people come here and testify like the lady did this morning.

I can cite law cases to you, in the law books, where individual rank and file people have come before legislative bodies and Congress and complained about some of the lack of democratic practices and other grievances that they might have had in their union and when they got back home they were kicked out of the union.

So, do you not think that that is something that Congress ought to be highly concerned with? It is not only that they come here but

that they are protected after having exercised that right, when they get back home.

Mr. MAHON. I think those guilty of the denial of democratic rights, whether it be in a union or any other organization or society, ought to be responsible.

Chairman BARDEN. Mr. Hiestand?

Mr. HIESTAND. Mr. Chairman, just along that line, I direct the witness' attention to the fact that the first sections of the Barden bill are designed just to protect against that kind of reprisal, the kicking out for having exercised the democratic privileges.

That is a protection to the union members as I read it.

I have no more questions.

Chairman BARDEN. That is what it was designed for.

Thank you, Mr. Mahon. I am very glad you came down.
Mr. MAHON. I appreciate the opportunity.

Chairman BARDEN. I hope you will be satisfied with the results of our effort.

Mr. MAHON. I shall be pleased to do anything additional that I can, if the committee calls on me.

Chairman BARDEN. Thank you.

Mr. LANDRUM. The committee is adjourned until 10 o'clock. (Whereupon, at 4:30 p.m., the hearing in the above-entitled matter was recessed.)

LABOR-MANAGEMENT REFORM LEGISLATION

THURSDAY, MARCH 19, 1959

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

JOINT SUBCOMMITTEE ON LABOR-MANAGEMENT

REFORM LEGISLATION, OF THE
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR,

Washington, D.C.

The subcommittee met at 10 a.m., pursuant to recess, in room 429, Old House Office Building, Hon. Carl T. Perkins (cochairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Present: Representatives Barden (chairman of the committee), Perkins, Wier, Landrum, Roosevelt, Holland, Pucinski, Ayres, Griffin, and Hiestand.

Present also: Russell C. Derrickson, acting clerk, full committee; Charles M. Ryan, general counsel; Melvin W. Sneed, minority clerk; Kenneth C. McGuiness, labor consultant to minority members; and W. Wilson Young, subcommittee clerk.

Mr. PERKINS. The committee will come to order.

We have with us this morning a distinguished witness who has been president of the Railway Clerks for more than 30 years, Mr. George M. Harrison.

Mr. Harrison, we appreciate your being here. We want you to proceed in any way that you desire and give the committee the benefit of your views and experience, which has been great over a long period of time.

Mr. WIER. Mr. Chairman, you might make known that because of the three bills we have today the House meets at 11 o'clock.

Mr. PERKINS. I have already discussed that with Mr. Harrison. He prefers to stick close to his statement a little while and prefers that we complete his testimony today, if possible.

I told him that we would do the best we could. I was well aware of that fact that we are reading the airport bill today. We concluded the general debate yesterday.

Am I right on that?

Mr. AYRES. Yes.

Mr. PERKINS. Really under the rules we cannot go ahead here while they are reading the bill.

Proceed, Mr. Harrison.

38488-59-pt. 1—28

417

STATEMENT OF GEORGE M. HARRISON, PRESIDENT, BROTHERHOOD OF RAILWAY & STEAMSHIP CLERKS, FREIGHT HANDLERS, EXPRESS & STATION EMPLOYEES; ACCOMPANIED BY EDWARD J. HICKEY, JR., GENERAL COUNSEL FOR THE RAILWAY LABOR EXECUTIVES ASSOCIATION

Mr. HARRISON. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, first I should say that my name is George M. Harrison. I am president of the Brotherhood of Railway & Steamship Clerks, Freight Handlers, Express & Station Employees.

I have offices at Cincinnati, Ohio, and I appear here this morning in behalf of the standard railway labor organizations affiliated with the Railway Labor Executives Association.

I am accompanied at the witness table by counsel, Mr. Edward J. Hickey, Jr., with offices in the Tower Building, Washington, D.C general counsel for the Railway Labor Executives Association, who assisted and collaborated with me in the preparation of the testimony I am about to give the committee in behalf of the organizations.

Some time ago when bills were introduced in the U.S. Senate dealing with labor-management relations our Railway Labor Executives Association appointed a committee and designated myself as the chairman, Mr. George E. Leighty, chairman of the Railway Labor Executives Association, and president of the Order of Railroad Telegraphers.

Mr. Michael Fox, vice chairman of the Railway Labor Executives Association, and president of the Railway Employees Department of the AFL-CIO.

Mr. Guy L. Brown, grand chief of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers.

And Mr. M. H. Schoch, president of the Railroad Yardmasters of America, as members of that committee to develop the position of the organizations and to take the responsibility for the presentation of their views to this committee.

The Railway Labor Executives Association is an organization of the chief executives of international and national railway labor unions which represent practically all employees in the railroad industry. The chief executives of the following rail unions are affiliated with our association:

American Railway Supervisors Association.
American Train Dispatchers Association.

Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers.

Brotherhood of Locomotive Firemen & Enginemen.

Brotherhood of Maintenance of Way Employees.

Brotherhood of Railway Carmen of America.

Brotherhood of Railroad Signalmen of America.

Brotherhood of Railway & Steamship Clerks, Freight Handlers, Express & Station Employees.

Brotherhood of Railroad Trainmen.

Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters.

Hotel & Restaurant Employees & Bartenders International Union.

International Association of Machinists.

International Brotherhood of Boilermakers, Iron Ship Builders, Blacksmiths Forgers & Helpers.

International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers.

International Brotherhood of Firemen & Oilers.

International Organization Masters, Mates & Pilots of America.
National Marine Engineers Beneficial Association.
Order of Railway Conductors & Brakemen.

Railroad Yardmasters of America.

Railway Employees Department, AFL-CIO.
Sheet Metal Workers International Association.
Switchmen's Union of North America.

The Order of Railroad Telegraphers.

There are approximately 18 bills which have been introduced in the House of Representatives dealing with labor-management reform legislation.

I do not intend to take this committee's time to discuss each of these bills, or even the majority of them.

I should like also to make clear at the outset of my statement that to the extent the unions for which I speak represent employees in the railroad and airline industries, they are subject to the provisions of the Railway Labor Act and are not covered by the Taft-Hartley Act.

Accordingly, we are not here concerned with the specific amendments to the Labor-Management Relations Act proposed by most of the bills before you.

For this reason, I shall make no comment on such proposal except to say that we support the policy statement of the federation on inclusion of certain of these amendments within any legislation that may be adopted by the Congress.

In terms of their basic objectives and subject matter, each of the pending 18 bills have already been the subject of detailed comment in statements presented to this committee on behalf of the AFL-CIO by President George Meany. Both in his oral testimony and in the written supplemental statement which he filed, the reasons for the federation's opposition to the administration's bill introduced in the House by Congressman Kearns, the two bills introduced by Chairman Barden, and certain other House measures were supplied in considerable detail.

The Railway Labor Executives Association subscribes to the policy position taken by the federation on these bills, and it would serve no useful purpose for me to repeat its reasons for that position as stated by President Meany.

I have a quite different purpose in presenting the views of the railroad brotherhoods here this morning, both on their behalf, and, also, we believe, on behalf of working men and women generally, and the public as a whole. That purpose is to urge adoption by this committee of only such regulatory labor legislation as is responsive to a proven need and which is constructive, not punitive, in its approach. It is our wish, as it is that of the AFL-CIO, to endorse legislation which really seeks to eliminate corruption and abuse.

But it is equally our desire to avoid unnecessary regulations which do not serve that end and legislative provisions which are either unworkable or ineffective.

In this connection, let me say that we endorse in principle the approach to the labor-management reform problem adopted by the following House bills:

H.R. 3302 introduced by Mrs. Green, H.R. 3372 introduced by Congressman Roosevelt, H.R. 3766 introduced by Congressman Thompson,