With participation increasing, need was evident for the means of transporting seniors to and from activities, doctors, getting their groceries, and so forth. Through the advisory councils and the incorporated board of directors, Hall County applied to the Nebraska Commission on Aging for the handi-buses. At the present time both buses are running at peak capacity in all counties.

We then applied for a nutrition grant which we received through title VII. We are serving many meals per day at several sites, two of which are in the very rural area. This was funded for all counties by the Nebraska Commission on Aging. Through the combined efforts of the church, a meals-on-wheels program was developed serving 25 to 35 meals per day to homebound individuals.

SENIOR CENTERS ESSENTIAL

At one time most of our activities centered in the Grand Island area. We have had a very difficult time getting the very rural elderly involved. We tried the news media through human interest stories, et cetera, to no avail. Outreach was sent out from the Grand Island area. It seemed everything failed. We then decided to take the programs to the rural community towns. We hired a part-time community aide from each town with the idea of developing an informational center for each area. The community became involved by providing space in churches, fire halls, town halls, et cetera. The centers became a focal point for all activities. The seniors were able to get information regarding services available to them in the community.

The seniors feel most comfortable with their own peer group and seem to develop a good rapport with the community aides. Even the most timid and withdrawn individuals become involved in one or more of the activities.

We at the rural level have found the senior center concept as a vehicle to get the local residents involved, for the simple reason the elderly have an opportunity to pitch in and help other individuals in need. By the same token, they have a feeling of dignity and pride in their own activities they themselves have helped to develop.

I came from a town by the name of Surprise, and it is a surprise, believe you me. It has a population of about 79, I think, at the present time. My mother still resides there. It is a tragic situation. Threefourths, I would say-maybe 90 percent-of those older people have no means of transportation. The doctors' facilities are not within 23 miles of this area and they have to depend on their children or, if the children are gone, the neighbors to get to the services in the health-related field or even to buy some of the groceries that they need. This is a very unpleasant situation. I do think when we develop centers in the rural areas the community gets involved, we have information and the old people know where to go to get help.

Thank you.

Senator CLARK. Thank you.

I want to thank the entire panel. I think they did a good job of reflecting the fact that the elderly people in rural communities have very wide ranging, different, and unique kinds of problems. That obviously is one of the concerns about trying to apply the Federal

system so that it does have some ability to adjust, be flexible, and to fit the specific needs of small communities.

I just have a couple of questions, and perhaps the Congressman does.

Since you still have the microphone over there by you, Margeone of the most impressive achievements of your efforts in Grand Island is the enlistment, I think, of about 140 persons in the retired senior volunteer program, and I am just wondering, very briefly, what kinds of things they did for the community and how did you get that many people involved?

Mrs. STINE. I wrote the original RSVP program, but before it was written, we went to the volunteer sites and explained to the community what these volunteers provide. Then we went to the advisory council and explained how much the people could gain by volunteering. In the rural areas at this time we did not have transportation. Transportation was provided. This gives the older people a chance to get out and get involved in the community. I think this is one of our greatest things, that we have transportation whether we do get out or not. We have, I think, over 163 members at the present time.

Senator CLARK. Over 163 now?

Mrs. STINE. Yes.

Senator CLARK. You don't think there is any secret in how you do it, you just go out and recruit them?

Mrs. STINE. Yes; but I think actually it is getting the older people involved. I don't know. It seems like we like to help our fellowmen, and I think it is one of the secrets that if they are helping someone, you don't have much problem in getting volunteers.

Senator CLARK. Let me ask Glen Soukup a question.

As I understand it, at one time you were involved as a director of the community action program-a CAP program. Now in Winterset when we opened these hearings yesterday afternoon just south of Des Moines, we heard about a well-run cooperative effort between the community action agency on the one hand and the area agency on aging on the other, but sometimes we hear of conflicts between the two. What has been your own experience and what would you recommend in terms of the Federal Government trying to create an atmosphere of cooperation as contrasted to some of the problems that we seem to have between the community action agency on the one hand and area agencies on aging on the other? What has been your experience and what would you recommend for us to consider to try to improve that?

COOPERATION SOMETIMES LACKING

Mr. SOUKUP. Well, in my experience, there is cooperation and lack of cooperation. In my own experience years ago, of course, we had a demonstration grant from AoA which was one of the original three pilots that resulted in the title VII feeding program, so I can say our cooperation was very good.

There have been problems recently between the community action programs and the area agencies on the local level because of disputes that go back a long way. The area agencies on aging came in after the CAP agencies were there and there seemed to be some problems.

What can you do at the Federal level? Anything in the way of enforced coordination that you can do and that we can do, of course, is going to help alleviate this problem in Nebraska. We are working on that very thing right now.

We just completed a companion study with an agency on the State level which deals with community action programs going into what the problems are and looking at possible solutions to them. We are in the finalization stage of this report at the present time. I guess we all know we have very limited resources and we have to do everything we can to get these resources used in the most effective way at the local and State levels. I believe that is what the people at the local level are interested in doing; however, there are problems involved. Senator CLARK. Thank you.

Congressman McCollister.

Representative MCCOLLISTER. Thank you, Senator.

I have two questions, but first an announcement that is, I think, very apropos to what the panel has been talking about.

Late yesterday afternoon we received word that a grant we had been working on for Douglas and Sarpy Counties of $100,000 has been made to provide a senior companion program for the elderly. Basically what it involves is the employment of 60 seniors at the minimum-wage rate, but it is nontaxable, and it also has, in addition, transportation and other services as part of it to provide some companionship for senior citizens-rural citizens in Douglas and Sarpy Countries that I think is going to be very, very helpful. As I heard your comments, I was struck by how very different the need is of rural communities compared with the urban communities who have, to date, received the bulk of the funds.

LOCAL CONTROL OF FUNDS

Now the first question. Recognizing that difference in need, and speaking of the Federal role in these programs, it is my belief and rural communities, in the sense that we know it in urban cmmunities, of Federal guidelines, and Federal strings attached to it, in order that each community or each rural agency may tailor their priorities to fit their need.

I will give you an example. It occurs to me that housing in most rural communities in particular are better served with a minimum is not the same thing at all. The programs of which you have spokenmaintenance and handyman services, visiting nurses-those are the things that you need in order to help the elderly maintain the highest degree of independence possible in their own community. Yet if the Federal Government sets the guideline, it seems to me, that you are likely to have mandated a priority of funds that is going to be somewhat different. Do vou agree with me that there should be a maximum of local determination of how Federal funds are to be used in tailoring a program for the rural level? Any disagreement?

Mr. MAGNUSSON. No disagreement whatever, John. Speaking as a local government representative, this is one big problem with Federal funding. They don't realize the local problems like we people do. I think if we got it with less strings attached we could do a much better job.

80-399-77

Representative MCCOLLISTER. You mentioned in your discussion on transportation that you regretted that so much of the Federal funds were used for administrative purposes at the expense of the money being directed to the actual services to be provided to the beneficiary recipients. It seems to me that it gives you a maximum of independence in the use of those funds that is helpful in reducing the administrative costs not only at the Federal level, but at the local level as well. The question on transportation to which you referred-you said you hoped it could be consolidated and that evidently a number of different efforts, each requiring its own administrative costs, now go forward, and you are hoping that there could be some kind of combination of those transportation services. Could you elaborate a little bit to give me a little better idea of what you mean? How is it done now?

TRANSPORTATION POOL PRACTICAL

Mr. MAGNUSSON. Now there are a number of organizations who are performing services for the elderly. Each organization is requesting buses through the Nebraska Highway Department on funding that has been in effect for 2 years. Too often these buses are only used for an hour or two a day. If we had a common transportation department or a central transportation department, all of these buses could be pooled on a central dispatch and when they were not being used for the one agency, then they would go into the pool to be used by another agency who has the need.

Representative MCCOLLISTER. Are you talking about multicounty, or within a county? MAPA as the coordinating agency?

Mr. MAGNUSSON. No; multicounty, because our senior citizens are multicounty. Two counties, Douglas and Sarpy, are the only two so far that have used it. Washington County is showing a great deal of interest and we are working with them. We hope we get the other two counties in region 6 to realize what they are doing or not doing for senior citizens.

So I think it should be central transportation agencies, such as MAPA, or somebody who has the knowhow of transportation. I am not a transportation man. There is no one on the Government Board that is a transportation expert. So it should come under the heading of somebody who is knowledgeable about transportation and knows what can and can't be done.

Representative MCCOLLISTER. These counties, of course, have a history-even back 6, 8, or 10 years ago-of coordinated effort. I refer, I guess, to the meeting of the tricounty watershed board, Encore, MAPA-I don't know how many others. All have demonstrated that the capacity and the attitude of these counties is to work together. I would hope that you could come together in some fashion to provide this coordinated effort.

Mr. MAGNUSSON. It just proves what county government can do; we can pool our resources at much less administrative cost and the public can get the job done.

Representative MCCOLLISTER. Thank you.

Thank you, Senator.

Senator CLARK. Thank you very much.

We want to thank the panel for some excellent testimony. It has been very helpful to us.

The next panel is Dorothy Switzer, host of the Grand Generation, editor of "The Dorothy Switzer Report," and a member of the Nebraska Commission on Aging; Helen Storms, Lizzie Springer, and Henry Knape.

Following this panel we will be hearing from Richard D. Heft, who is chairman of the Harlan County Board in Alma, Nebr., and Hans Jensen, legislative committee chairman of the Nebraska Senior Citizens Council in Aurora, Nebr.

We are going to start now with Dorothy Switzer, member of the Nebraska Commission on Aging.

I might ask each of you, because of the time problem, to try to limit your opening statement to 5 minutes; then we will have more time for discussion.

STATEMENT OF DOROTHY SWITZER, HOST, THE GRAND GENERATION; EDITOR, "THE DOROTHY SWITZER REPORT"; AND MEMBER OF THE NEBRASKA COMMISSION ON AGING. LINCOLN, NEBR.

Mrs. SWITZER. Thank you.

The Grand Generation is a program which appears on the Nebraska Educational Television Network supported, in part, financially by the Nebraska Commission on Aging. It has just completed its third year and in October will begin its fourth year. It is a program designed for older Nebraskans, and we are very happy to always be of service. We have a toll-free telephone line known as the hot line on which people may call us with their problems. I am basing my testimony today largely on the letters and the telephone calls we have receivedthey number in the thousands now.

On each of the weekly Grand Generation programs on the Nebraska Educational Network in the months of October through June, I present an information report, "The Dorothy Switzer Report," on subjects thought to be of interest and importance to older Nebraskans. The information reports are compiled and distributed by mail twice a month to a mailing list of more than 1 thousand individuals, groups, and agencies. As many elderly Nebraskans do not have access to television, the printed report is intended primarily for them. The report is also used in numerous ways by senior citizen centers and by appropriate public and private agencies concerned with needs and problems of the aging.

My testimony, based on the kinds of inquiries that come to the Grand Generation, emphasizes very strongly the fact that the elderly in Nebraska and the rural elderly, in particular, wish to remain independent in their own homes as long as possible to avoid having to be institutionalized. They need exactly the same kinds of supportive services which, happily, are now being received by many of the urban elderly. The rural elderly urgently need access to health delivery systems and to home health care and physical therapy. They need homemaker and handyman services, congregate hot meals and, in some cases, meals-onwheels. They also need opportunities for recreation and socialization.