that if he voluntarily separates himself from his Federal job, that then he is to receive unemployment compensation in the same manner as if he were a private employee or had been forced out of the position by his employer, which would be the Government.

Is my understanding correct?

Secretary MITCHELL. Senator Thye, with 1 or 2 minor deviations. He is to receive compensation in the State in which he was eligible in the same way and under the same rules that a private employee would receive such compensation. And the rules vary from State to State.

Senator THYE. I am familiar with that. But the amendment placed on this section of the bill on the floor of the House would, in the event that the employee voluntarily quit Federal employment, disqualify him from drawing compensation?

Secretary MITCHELL. Right.

Senator THYE. He would be qualified only when he was forced out of his job. I can see where many an able man would be going into some private employment or business of his own and might be justly entitled to such compensation under State law, much more so than the man whose services were found to be unsatisfactory and he was kicked out. That is the way I see it.

Secretary MITCHELL. That is right.

EMPLOYMENT FOR OLDER WORKERS

Senator THYE. There is one other question I would like to get cleared up, Mr. Chairman, and that is this sum of $40,000 requested to conduct programs aimed at promoting employment for older workers. I think that is one of the soundest provisions of the entire appropriation involved here for this reason: Suppose a man reaches age 58 or 60 and he for some reason or other loses his job; he has absolutely no opportunity to go in competitively and bid against the 30-year olds, because no employer is going to think seriously about employing a man unless he is specifically skilled in some particular field. But if he is an ordinary worker, chances are pretty well foreclosed of his ever getting a job when he gets up near the sixties, because he has only 4 or 5 more years before he would be forced to retire.

So for that reason, Mr. Chairman, if we here in Congress have any responsibility at all, it is to take care of these people who are approaching the eve of their lives and through no fault of their own their job has been brought to a close, or they have been forced to become unemployed, they have no avenue to step into to find a friendly face or helping hand, and if anyone had a need for some Federal consideration it is that type of employee, I care not whether he be man or

woman.

I think we should emphasize that in our report and follow it through as carefully as we can.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator HILL. Senator Potter?

DETROIT EXAMPLE

Senator POTTER. Along that line, we have had a tragic example in Detroit when the Hudson Motor Car Co. moved to Milwaukee.

We had men with 20, 25 years of experience. In the first place they found it most difficult to secure employment in another plant because the economic considerations in a pension plan are such that an employer will normally take a younger man rather than a man in the later forties. Also, if he does secure employment in another plant, he starts in at the lowest rung of seniority, and he is the first one laid off if there should be a letup there. So it is a major problem, and I am happy to see that your Department is most interested in it.

As a matter of fact, I have a bill which was cosponsored by 55 Senators, to set the coarea problems relating to the agency.

Senator CHAVEZ. Mr. Chairman, I note that Under Secretary Larson has a statement on that subject, employment of the older worker. Can we insert that in the record at this point?

PREPARED STATEMENT

Mr. LARSON. I have a very brief statement on the employment problems of the older workers, Mr. Chairman.

Senator HILL. That may go into the record at this point. (The statement referred to follows:)

STATEMENT OF ARTHUR LARSON, UNDER SECRETARY

PROMOTION OF EMPLOYMENT OF THE OLDER WORKER

We have asked for a relatively small sum to begin studying a difficult and constantly growing problem-the problem of finding work for older people. I can only take enough of your time here to cover the highlights of the problem, but, for amplification, I should like to make available to you copies of an article in the January 7, 1955, issue of Collier's by Secretary Mitchell. Medical advances, and the generally beneficial circumstances of the life we enjoy in these United States, have enabled many more of our people to survive to later years. Since 1900, while total population has doubled, the number of persons aged 45-64 has tripled, the number 65 and over had quadrupled. Employment practices have failed to change with the change in the age composition of our population. Life expectancy has increased; work-life expectancy has decreased.

Older people may be divided into 2 groups: (1) those 65 and over—many of whom have the choice of continuing at work or of retiring; and (2) those between 45 and 64-those who are too young to retire but seemingly too old to hire. Men in these middle ages have dependents to support, mortgages to pay. They must find jobs when they are out of work, and these are hard for the 40-plus to find even in the best of times.

There are 33 million people between 45-64 of whom 21 million are in the labor force. In November 1954, according to a Bureau of Employment Security study and Census data, about one-half million men between 45-64 were unemployed. A November count of the active files of the State employment services showed 682,000 unemployed men and women 45-64 and a total of 815,000 unemployed 46 and over.

Older workers at the employment service

The problems of older workers are clearly seen in the State employment service offices. Limited studies in 1950 and 1952 showed that older workers were 28 percent of all applicants but made up 42 percent of unemployment compensation claimants. However, about 60 percent of the jobs listed by employers in want ads or in the employment offices were restricted to persons under 45 (for women mainly under 35). The duration of unemployment and the rate of exhaustion of benefits rose directly with age. Consider the situation of men who at 45 or 50 cannot find work and yet have 22 to 26 years of life expectancy. Those years would look bleak indeed.

Workers 65 and over

I have been speaking mainly of the middle-aged. The average older person 65 years and up presents a somewhat different problem but still a difficult one.

Many of them neither want nor can afford to retire. When we look at trends in the costs of retirement, it is extremely doubtful that the Nation should want them to do so. OASI benefit payments in 1952 were $2.3 billion. In the present fiscal year they will be $4.7 billion. With the 1954 amendments and with high employment in 1970 they will be $11.3 billion. To these amounts must be added an indeterminate amount in private pensions and other public and private welfare programs. The present typical retirement age is not 65 but 69. If the trend toward earlier retirement continues or increases, costs obviously will rise above these estimates. A major factor affecting these costs is the opportunity for continued employment for older people. If we increase rather than decrease employment for older people, costs would be lowered and standards of living would be higher for them and for the rest of the population.

The Department of Labor must seek solutions to the older worker problem. We are seeking to avoid measures of compulsion in favor of persuasion and education based on facts. The studies we are hoping to undertake would make a good beginning toward determining the actual underlying causes of these problems, and in working toward solutions.

We

One of the frequent reasons given by employers for age limitations in hiring is the extent and costs of pension and insurance programs. We need to find out what these costs are and if there is any way in which this impediment can be minimized. This is one important area of research to be initiated in 1956. would like to initiate some pilot studies on hiring, utilization, transfer and separation policies, problems, and practices, and to gather facts on the productivity of older workers, their accident and absenteeism rates, etc. We would hope to find some examples of desirable policies and practices in particular industries and occupations which can be publicized for the use of other employers. Employers are going to be convinced only by facts, especially facts about firms in situations similar to their own. Some of these studies will be onetime projects but others will enable us to determine efficient methods of gathering needed information through our usual reporting channels. As sufficient material for educational purposes accumulates, it will be put to use in improving the Department's services to older workers.

We are asking for $173,000 covering 34 jobs to initiate the program which I have just described.

EFFECTS OF HOUSE ACTION

Senator HILL. You may proceed, sir.

Secretary MITCHELL. I would like to continue now, Mr. Chairman, and speak to the specifics with relation to some of our major problems in the Office of the Secretary and the effects of the House action on our appropriation, assuming that the Bureau heads will follow and will take up the individual Bureaus.

Senator CHAVEZ. Are you going to commence with the manpower mobilization and civil defense?

Secretary MITCHELL. Senator, just before you came in I stated that on the manpower mobilization and civil defense, the House had disapproved some $300,000 of our requests, allowing only $160,000 for the older worker. The manpower and civil-defense activities we are not requesting this committee to do anything about because, by arranging with the Bureau of the Budget-and other departments have the same problem-it has been decided to make that request for all of the departments in one supplemental request. So we are not addressing ourselves to that.

SALARIES AND EXPENSES

APPROPRIATION ESTIMATE

Salaries and expenses: For expenses necessary for the Office of the Secretary of Labor (hereafter in this title referred to as the Secretary), including services as authorized by section 15 of the act of August 2, 1946 (5 U. S. C. 55a); teletype news service; and payment in advance when authorized by the Secretary for dues

or fees for library membership in organizations whose publications are available to members only or to members at a price lower than to the general public; [$1,327,000] $1,527,000, of which not more than [$85,000] $185,000 shall be for international labor affairs.

Initially this item was requested as a separate appropriation. Because of House action it is now reflected as an activity in this request.

Immediate Office of the Secretary, to carry out the responsibilities in

the development of legislation with other agencies of Government, organizations, and the Congress:

200, 000

10, 800

820

9, 970 42

10, 012

76

10, 088

INCREASES-continued

Office of the Under Secretary, to provide for an assistant to the Under

Office of the Assistant Secretaries:

To provide for an assistant to the Assistant Secretary for Standards and Statistics and a secretary:

To provide a staff to develop and coordinate a program on the skills of the work force:

$17, 205

1, 323

15, 882

66

15, 948

2, 720

18, 668

17, 205

1, 320

15, 885

66

15, 951

2, 720

18, 671

39, 775

2, 864

36, 911

153

37, 064

Nonlabor...

Subtotal_.

2, 936

40, 000

Total, activity No. 1.

87, 427

Office of International Labor Affairs, to provide for an assistant to the Assistant Secretary and additional staff to enable the Department to meet the increasing demands in the field of international labor: 15 permanent positions_