Senator RANDOLPH. Thank you, Governor Smith.

Senator Muskie, I know of a commitment you have in a very few minutes. You are very kind to be with us to listen to the statement of Governor Smith of West Virginia and I would like to have you question at this time.

Senator MUSKIE. It is a privilege to join in welcoming Governor Smith here. I don't really want to take the time to ask questions now but I would like to make a comment or two on some of the Governor's suggestions for modification of the program.

I share his belief in the value of the accelerated public works program. I share what I am sure is his regret that that program has not been continued in the previous Congress to this one. Because of the urgent need for the program in many areas of the country, including my own State and areas which also have problems similar to Appalachia in upgrading the level of economic activity, I would hesitate to support a suggestion that we include an accelerated public works program for Appalachia alone.

I think that we ought to concentrate our effort on renewing the program for the country as a whole because we need it badly, too. I am afraid that if we get it included in the Appalachia program that we would tend to minimize the possibilities for getting it for the other parts of the country.

I would agree with your opinion of the great value of the accelerated public works program as a part of the program for developing areas like Appalachia. In that respect we share a common view.

I also share with you your concern about the failure of the urban renewal program to meet the needs of small States and small communities. We have had a similar experience in our State. As a member of the Senate Banking and Currency Committee, I have been involved with the urban renewal program. I would hope that it might be possible for you to state these views in that committee. I think that really the answer to it is not the suggestion that you have here but the frontal attack upon the problem in the Banking and Currency Committee directed at the Housing and Home Finance Agency.

We have an Agency which grew in response to the very critical urban problems of large metropolitan areas and because it grew that way it developed a tremendous amount of bureaucratic redtape that is geared to the like bureaucratic redtape in the big metropolitan cities which small cities are not in a position to match.

I voiced this concern in the Banking and Currency Committee last year when officials of the Housing and Home Finance Agency testified on the urban renewal program at that time. In response to that the Agency itself now has undertaken some pilot programs, one in my own State, designed to develop approaches which are geared to the administrative machinery of small States.

So I welcome your testimony on that, too, Governor, and I look forward to inviting your participation in hearings at an appropriate time before the Banking and Currency Committee.

Governor SMITH. Thank you very much, Senator Muskie. I certainly would be delighted to appear before the Banking and Currency Committee. I recognize the fact that this is a field that is not germane perhaps to the bill that we are considering today, but it is a field

in which we are most interested in, in West Virginia, and you are interested in, in Maine.

Only a few days ago in a talk in Charleston, that was pointed out very clearly: the problem of urban renewal in small cities as against larger cities. Whereas they have staffs of over 50 employees in cities such as Norfolk, Va., and Scranton, Pa., in Charleston they are able to afford 3 and Bluefield and Huntington, 6 apiece as far as the communities of West Virginia.

This is where the problem arises and that is why there is not more of this very valuable rebuilding of America in the smaller communities of this Nation. I certainly would like the opportunity to appear. Senator MUSKIE. Actually, there is more future in the small communities than there is in a big one.

Thank you, Governor.

Senator RANDOLPH. I would like to note the presence of Curtis Aul, the mayor of Vienna, this morning. As you know, Governor, Mr. Aul has been president of the West Virginia League of Municipalities. I noted expression of approval when you spoke about a program of expanded or accelerated public works. He testified, as I recall, on that legislation at the time we had hearings here in the Public Works Committee of the Senate.

I would also call attention to the presence of Emery Woodall, who is the postmaster in Palermo, in Lincoln County, W. Va. I don't want to be provincial in anywise, but out of a rural county like Lincoln in which Mr. Woodall lives, a young man came, Chuck Yeager, the first man in America to fly faster than the speed of sound. I remember very well at the Wright brothers dinner I was talking informally before the banquet with Chuck Yeager about some West Virginia matters and this man standing nearby, an admiral with gold braid, said, "What do you know, Mr. Yeager, about West Virginia?" And he replied, "Well, I was born so far up the hollow that we almost had to pipe the sunshine in." In other words, he was a young man who had come from the recesses of the ridges of this mountain area. We can bring rewards to these ridges and in a sense, riches to the people.

Your testimony is very helpful today.

Senator Cooper.

Senator COOPER. Your testimony has been very comprehensive. I think you know your State has a very able representative here on this committee. I am sure we will hear a great deal about your recommendations.

I have no questions.

Senator RANDOLPH. You have given us some recommendations, not just suggestions. We are going to give them very careful attention. Governor SMITH. Thank you.

Senator RANDOLPH. Senator Boggs.

Senator BOGGS. Mr. Chairman, I feel very much as Senator Cooper does. I am happy to welcome Governor Smith and to meet you. I would certainly say for your first week you have had a busy one, Governor. You are starting out very well and I wish you every

success.

Governor SMITH. Thank you, Senator.

Senator RANDOLPH. Representative Hechler, I accorded the privilege to Representative Mathias of commenting on Senator Brewster's remarks before the committee.

Would you desire to make any comment? You have worked on this legislation in the House and your area of the State was very much in need of this program. While Governor Smith is here would you help by your testimony informally from the place where you sit?

STATEMENT OF HON. KEN HECHLER, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA

Mr. HECHLER. Mr. Chairman, certainly by his testimony Governor Smith has shown his deep and perceptive appreciation of the problems in the Appalachian region. I, too, am greatly interested in what Governor Smith has recommended concerning planning assistance for communities the size of Vienna which Mayor All presides

over.

I think it is absolutely necessary to develop an urban renewal program. I am also very pleased that Governor Smith has brought out the tremendous value of accelerated government works programs in West Virginia. I have yet to find a Member of the House and Senate who disagrees with this conclusion.

I think we ought to start a little revolution to get this program revised. I would concur with Senator Muskie that may not be the bill to put it on and it may not be possible to connect it with any other program. I think it is vital for the development of the economy, not only the Appalachian region but the rest of the country, that the accelerated public works program be continued. Here we have a program where the machinery is already set up, we do not have to set up any new or expensive bureaucracy, and I think it is highly important to commend Governor Smith.

Senator RANDOLPH. Thank you, Representative Hechler.

We have with us today also from West Virginia, Representative Kee, and I refer to him as Jim. He is the newest member of our delegation. I served with your father and your mother and now it is good to serve with you, this fine family giving so much in constructive contribution to West Virginia, in particular, the Fifth District.

You are now a member of the Public Works Committee of the House.

Mr. KEE. Correct.

Senator RANDOLPH. I think you might want to comment while Governor Smith is here.

STATEMENT OF HON. JAMES KEE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA

Mr. KEE. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to appear before your Public Works Committee.

First, I would like to say that the Public Works Committee of the U.S. Senate should be highly commended as your first program of 1965 started immediately on the Appalachian region. You are certainly to be commended and I want to join wholeheartedly in the recommendations made by Governor Smith.

I would like to make just one brief observation, Mr. Chairman. The provision in this bill, of which I have a counterpart bill introduced in the House, in the Appalachian region back in 1964, is merely asking the Congress to do what it has done ever since we have had a Congress in our form of government, and that is to promote the general welfare. That is exactly what this bill provides. It does not provide any specific favors in one particular area at all.

The TVA, and our major flood control projects, you know, are matters of national concern and matters in which our local communities do not have the facilities or finances or otherwise to do it themselves.

While every proposal in this bill is important, I think that one of the most important ones, and perhaps No. 1, is conservation of our water resources.

No. 2, what we desperately need in the Appalachian region is the highway development system.

No. 3, additional help in medical facilities;

No. 4, which has been touched on earlier, assistance from vocational educational facilities.

At this point, Mr. Chairman, I respectfully request permission to file a more detailed formal statement.

Senator RANDOLPH. Yes, that is accorded to you, Representative Kee.

(Subsequently, Representative Kee filed the following statement:)

PREPARED STATEMENT OF HON. JAMES KEE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE FIFTH WEST VIRGINIA DISTRICT

Mr. Chairman and other distinguished members of the Special Subcommittee on Appalachian Development of the Senate Public Works Committee, I deeply appreciate this opportunity, which you have so graciously extended, to present this statement. Especially am I gratified that West Virginia's senior Member of the U.S. Senate, the Honorable Jennings Randolph, is the chairman of this important subcommittee. I am equally gratified, Mr. Chairman, that your committee has scheduled this public hearing at an early stage of the 89th Congress, thereby reflecting the tantamount importance of expeditious consideration and action therein.

Gentlemen, the Fifth West Virginia District consists of Fayette, Mercer, Mingo, Monroe, McDowell, Summers, and Wyoming Counties, and the entire district is geographically and physically located in the middle of the Appalachian area encompassed by the proposed Appalachian Regional Development Act of 1965. Throughout this entire region, the level of prosperity has experienced cyclical variations which have presented many difficult problems for our people, including the complete range of social and economic challenges; however, one of the basic problems inherent in this beautiful God-given environment is that of terrain adversity, creating a most difficult situation involving natural resources and the elements of God.

It is earnestly hoped and believed by its sponsors that the proposed Appalachian Regional Development Act will do something more than give a "shotin-the-arm" to the basic economy of West Virginia. Over the next few years, this plan, if enacted by Congress, should mean a virtual economic rebirth for the whole Appalachian region. The special Commission appointed by the President of the United States to consider the particular problems of this area said this: "Economic studies have demonstrated that if Appalachia's economy merely equaled the national average, approximately $12 billion could be added to the gross national product through retail sales; approximately $5.2 billion could be added to our annual rate of personal income; and another $1 billion could be added in new housing construction."

The President's Commission proposed a series of practical, down-to-earth programs which form the basis of the legislation now before the Congress. These

provisions are designed to (1) improve general health conditions, (2) to foster the reclamation of coal lands scarred by the operations of former years, (3) to promote the orderly utilization of timber lands, (4) to encourage the development of a thriving livestock industry, and (5) to make better use of the Nation's water resources. This measure also includes (6) a gigantic program of road construction because it has been amply demonstrated that without adequate roads economic progress is impossible. Good roads are aqually essential to the development of recreational facilities, a subject of vital importance to the residents of southern West Virginia.

To avoid misunderstanding, it should be made clear that the proposed Appalachian Regional Development Act is not discriminatory-it is not legislation based on favoritism. We are asking the Congress to do what it has done hundreds of times before to promote the general welfare. The development of rivers and harbors is a Federal function and the taxpayers of our State help foot the bill. The Tennessee Valley Authority was a regional project and so were the dams erected with Federal funds on the Colorado and Columbia Rivers-and let us not forget the Bluestone Reservoir. The Federal Government has initiated a relief program for the flood victims of the west coast. Helping its citizens to help themselves has been a function of the Federal Government since its beginning. The proposed Appalachian Regional Development Act is a continuation of this fine tradition.

As a newly appointed member of the House Public Works Committee, I am looking forward to detailed consideration and effort for the final presentation of legislation which will permit the expeditious implementation of the Appalachian Regional Development Act of 1965.

For over a period of 20 years, the Fifth West Virginia District has been plagued with devastating floods which have deterred the development of economic activities within such counties as McDowell, Mingo, and Wyoming. I am most pleased that section 206, "Water Resource Survey" provides for recommendations for the control of floods, the regulation of the rivers to enhance their value as sources of water supply for industrial and municipal development, the prevention of water pollution by drainage from mines, the development and enhancement of the recreational potential of the region, and water related purposes.

In presenting this statement to this distinguished committee, I am most pleased to encourage and support expeditious consideration for approval and implementation of the Appalachian Regional Development Act of 1965.

Senator RANDOLPH. I can't forego the opportunity, with three Representatives here, two Democrats and a Republican, Representative Mathias, to hear you men say whether you think this legislation, when it has passed the Senate, will pass the House?

You will recall in the 88th Congress apparently there was some difference of opinion. I would like to hear I am going to put you on the spot, if you don't mind just what you really believe the House will do in this matter. I will ask Representative Mathias first.

Mr. MATHIAS. Senator, I would be optimistic about the passage of this program. I have been in this game long enough to know that you can't count on any vote but your own, but we do have a great chairman of the Public Works Committee in the House who happens to be a Marylander. I am sure all his efforts will be very enthusiastically engaged in promoting the bill.

I think there is a recognition that this program is of importance to the whole country and not just to those of us who live in Appalachia, and with this national interest, I think we have fair prospects.

Senator RANDOLPH. Thank you. Representative Hechler?

Mr. HECHLER. Well, you can do all the analyzing you want, but there was a little thing that happened on the 3d of November that will make it absolutely 100-percent sure that this bill will go through, because we now have the horses to put it through the House of Representatives.

Senator RANDOLPH. Representative Kee?

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