often we go through a program of preschool to the post-Ph. D. level, and we have never really been exposed to an effective environment for learning which has an infinite array of possible responses by the creative learner.

I suggest we get as close to the real world as we can. When this is not possible, we can simulate the environment in a sophisticated wayusing media and new communication technologies such as holography, which is a three-dimensional projected image.

At the same time, I think we need more effective transportation systems. It is like bringing Mohammed to the mountain rather than the mountain to Mohammed. Our first concern should be to transport the learner to the learning resource.

Mr. BELL. Wouldn't our concepts be scattered in that, though? You would be changing at quite a pace. It is a different approach. True, we are moving gradualy now, but this is going to be quite a step.

Is there going to be any pattern to keep one area from going way out over here and one in the other direction? This is a relatively new concept we have had in more recent years. We have talked about it in the past, and now it is really coming in to its own, and if you move pretty fast, I would see where the approach could be scattered.

This might weaken your system.

We have to reach some kind of a central pattern, it seems to me. Is this your thinking, too?

Mr. HAWKINS. Well, Mr. Bell, I think we can learn from an old social work principle; you start with people where they are, but you don't necesarily stay there.

We have the reality of formal education as it is now. Our organization represents both the old guard and young Turk elements. We have to work with both groups, and at the same time we have to take advantage of what we know about the science of learning and the art of living.

We need to try innovative programs. The Ford Foundation has invested a million dollars in the English model that I mentioned earlier, and I just feel that schools can no longer be put in the traditional two-by-four-by-six context-knowledge dispensed via the book with two covers, in the four-wall classroom, 6 hours a day.

Mr. BELL. Nobody is arguing on that point. I agree there. But I can see where it could go from that to something which is too far in too many different directions on a complicated subject.

Mr. LUMLEY. I would say you go gradually. As I said to you, the method of teaching and how teachers are operating in the schools has changed drastically in the last 5 years.

This would simply be a continuation, insofar as they would have different material. Here you are including environmental educational materials as a part of the teacher's whole background. It has to be related to the teacher in the science class or the teacher in the history class, but the teachers have to have this new knowledge of the facts that they are teaching children.

Now, we were talking about the formal school program, whether it be in the elementary school or high school or even in the college. But in addition to that, the concept that we are putting across here is also community education. We come back to talking again about what the chairman asked me a minute ago.

You see, it is the land-grant idea and what the county agents did for the farmers of this country and what they are still doing for the farmers, and what the home economics people are doing.

This is community education and community participation. This can make people aware of what is going on by using the methods we have. We are not just thinking of the school and what happens from the kindergarten to the 12th grade. We are trying to visualize this whole program of education, and the teachers have to fit in and make their contribution at whatever level they are in.

But I don't believe it has to be a radical change. It has to be a consciousness of the problems and how teachers can contribute, and the materials that are developed by this staff will make it possible for them to do this.

Mr. BELL. Do you think the majority of the teachers are constituted today so as to be able to make this transition, whether it be gradual or quick!

Mr. LUMLEY. Let me say that I hope they are. And I think the large majority of them would be; yes.

Mr. BELL. Yes, Mr. Hawkins?

Mr. HAWKINS. I think your question is a strategy question. I think the longer term goal here is complete reform in the way we diffuse knowledge. We are moving into hyphenated disciplines. Combining knowledge areas which were formerly sacrosanct. We need human ecology and thematic approaches, as an alternative to overspecialization. Perhaps the ecology approach should be designed more for the life of the mind and to improve the quality of our total environment. Perhaps specialization will be more important for vocational development as we move from a work-oriented society to perhaps a quality of life-oriented society.

But I think there is a strategy we could use right now and that is to simply expand the learning opportunities to young people in the concrete real world by encouraging the use of environmental study areas—cultural, natural, historic, urban spaces, sources of pollution— where learning is maximized.

All learning cannot take place in a classroom. Exposure to environmental study courses can be supported by preliminary lessons and followthrough lessons in the classroom. I think that is perhaps why I have emphasized the environmental study approach and the environment facility approach as an immediate strategy, because by changing the environment for learning, by expanding it, something is going to happen to the learner and something is going to happen to the teacher.

Mr. BELL. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. BRADEMAS. Thank you very much, Dr. Lumley and Mr. Hawkins. We are very grateful to you for having come.

The Chair wants to take a moment to recognize some of our visitors here today, who I think I am right in saying come from the State of Kentucky. Do you come from the district of the chairman of this committee, Mr. Perkins?

SPOKESMAN. We just wanted to drop in and visit a committee hearing since we have never had that opportunity.

We represent the Kentucky 4-H Older Youth Conference which is here this week.

Mr. BRADEMAS. We are particularly pleased to welcome you and, in particular, the Committee on Education and Labor, because the chairman of this committee is one of the most influential Members of the Congress, Representative Carl D. Perkins from the State of Kentucky, who has contributed as much as any member of either the House or the Senate in writing legislation to strengthen the schools of our country.

So Kentuckians are always welcome here, and we are glad to see you here today.

We are now adjourned.

(Whereupon, at 11:30 a.m. the subcommittee was adjourned, subject to call of the Chair.)

ENVIRONMENTAL QUALITY EDUCATION ACT

TUESDAY, APRIL 21, 1970

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

SELECT SUBCOMMITTEE ON EDUCATION,
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR,

Washington, D.C.

The subcommittee met at 10 a.m., pursuant to recess, in room 2175, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. John Brademas (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Present: Representatives Brademas, Meeds, Reid, Bell, and Hansen. Staff members present: Jack G. Duncan, counsel; Ronald L. Katz, assistant staff director; Maureen Orth, consultant; Toni Immerman, clerk; Arlene Horowitz, staff assistant; and Marty L. LaVor, minority legislative coordinator.

Mr. BRADEMAS. The subcommittee will come to order.

We are very pleased to have as our first witness this morning Commissioner of Education, Assistant Secretary of Health, Education, and Welfare for Education, the Honorable Dr. James E. Allen, Jr. The Chair would like to observe that he has read with very great interest a splendid address delivered on January 23, 1970, by Commissioner Allen before the American Council of Learned Societies, in which the Commissioner challenges us to participate in a reorientation of American education toward environmental studies.

He went ahead to say the responsibility of the Government is to lead and to develop the environmental orientation programs in our schools as well as at every stage of adult education, and then he concludes by urging among the several activities in which he hoped that members of the Council of Learned Societies support appropriate educational environmental activities.

As a matter of fact, Mr. Secretary, I regard your speech as one of the most perceptive summaries for the purpose of the legislation that we are considering here today, and I am all the more pleased to welcome you here this morning.

STATEMENT OF DR. JAMES E. ALLEN, JR., COMMISSIONER OF EDUCATION, ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF HEALTH, EDUCATION AND WELFARE; ACCOMPANIED BY LOGAN H. SALLADA, SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO THE COMMISSIONER, AND ALBERT L. ALFORD, ASSISTANT COMMISSIONER FOR LEGISLATION

Commissioner ALLEN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

First, I am accompanied here by Mr. Logan H. Sallada of my staff, as special assistant to the Commissioner, who has been a leader in my