feel let down certainly, because, indirectly at least, it amounts to adult American Communists financing an attack upon the United States of America through the young Communists at the festival, who did not defend their own nation.

Mr. WILEY. There are two things I would like to mention if you have a second to do it. Is that all right, Mr. Chairman ?

One is that, in view of the Post's editorial about the American delegates to the festival being punished by this committee, I have gotten together a list and I want to stress this-this is not a complete list-but it is a reasonably complete list. There are probably 25 or 30 people in addition who should be on it. But this is the best that

I could do.

This is a list of Americans who were in Vienna. This is a list of anti-Communists and non-Communists. In some places people who went along with the Communists sometimes, but at least on one occasion stood up against them and did not follow the party line.

I could not possibly read it. There are a couple hundred names here. For the protection of those who did go to Vienna for the United States to present the American viewpoint, I would like to get this into the record if I could have it put in the record, Mr. Chairman. (Document marked "Wiley Exhibit No. 1" and retained in committee files.)

The CHAIRMAN. I would not be too disturbed by this Post editorial. The same issue of the Post had a story about a case being dismissed in a United States Court when actually only a count of the indictment was stricken.

I would not be concerned about the accuracy of anything you read

in that paper.

I appreciate very much what you have done and I am sure our whole

committee does.

It is indeed unfortunate that the youngsters in this country, thirsty, as most of them are, for knowledge, are not made aware of the pitfalls that are along their path.

This sort of thing that you have just described is typical of it. I do not know how many young people will go to the next meeting who are anti-Communists. But it seems to me that in the consideration of the legislation that this committee has just had drafted, we ought to make very strong recommendations to the Committee on Foreign Affairs on the advisability of selecting people to attend meetings of this sort officially. Of course, if anybody else wants to go, that is a different story; that makes no difference. But I think that the official representation ought to be people of whom we do not have to be ashamed.

From what I know of this meeting there are a great many Americans that we certainly cannot be very proud of.

That I think concludes the hearing for this morning. The committee will meet tomorrow at 10 a.m.

(Whereupon, at 11:25 a.m., Thursday, February 4, 1960, the subcommittee recessed to reconvene at 10:00 a.m., Friday, February 5, 1960.)

COMMUNIST TRAINING OPERATIONS

Part 3

(Communist Activities and Propaganda Among Youth

Groups)

FRIDAY, FEBRUARY 5, 1960

UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE

COMMITTEE ON UN-AMERICAN ACTIVITIES,

PUBLIC HEARINGS

Washington, D.C.

The subcommittee of the Committee on Un-American Activities. met, pursuant to recess, at 10:00 a.m., in the Caucus Room, Old House Office Building, Washington, D.C., Honorable Francis E. Walter (chairman) presiding.

Subcommittee members: Representatives Francis E. Walter, Pennsylvania, chairman; Clyde Doyle, California; Edwin E. Willis, Louisiana; Donald L. Jackson, California; and Gordon H. Scherer, Ohio. Committee members present during hearings: Representatives Walter; Doyle; Scherer; Moulder, Missouri; Tuck, Virginia; and Johansen, Michigan. (Appearances as noted.)

Staff members present: Richard Arens, staff director, and Donald T. Appell and Robert H. Goldsborough, investigators.

The CHAIRMAN. The committee will be in order.

Will you call your first witness, Mr. Arens?

Mr. ARENS. Joseph Charles Jones.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Jones, will you raise your right hand?

Do you swear the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth so help you God?

Mr. JONES. I do.

Mr. ARENS. Please identify yourself by name, residence, and ocupation.

TESTIMONY OF JOSEPH CHARLES JONES

Mr. JONES. I am Joseph Charles Jones, a student at Johnson C. Smith University, in Charlotte, N.C., in the theological department. The CHAIRMAN. What denomination?

Mr. JONES. Presbyterian.

The CHAIRMAN. You are studying for the ministry?

Mr. JONES. Yes, sir.

Mr. ARENS. Did you attend the Seventh World Youth Festival in Vienna this past summer?

Mr. JONES. Yes, I did.

51693-60-pt. 3- -5

Mr. DOYLE. May I raise the point that the witness is here without legal counsel.

Mr. ARENS. He is a friendly witness.

The CHAIRMAN. This may be funny to some of you, but to those of us who are interested in trying to work out legislation, this is a very serious matter. The Chair will not tolerate any demonstrations. If there are any more, the room will be cleared.

Mr. DOYLE. I realize that, but I still raise the question that under our rules he is entitled to it, and I would like to have the record show that he waives it, if he does.

Mr. JONES. I really saw no need for having counsel, Mr. Doyle, because I would hope that things brought out here would not need any legal counseling. So I did not request it.

Mr. DOYLE. Excuse me for interrupting.

Mr. ARENS. Did you attend the Seventh World Youth Festival held in Vienna this past summer?

Mr. JONES. Yes, I did.

Mr. ARENS. Would you give us just a word, please, as to the reasons why your interest was first created in the festival and why you arranged personally to attend the festival?

Mr. JONES. Yes. I had been working with a student organization, the United States National Student Association, which had taken a stand against the festival, because they felt it was a propaganda tool of the Soviet Government, using it to further the propaganda of the Communist Party.

Because of my work with the United States National Student Association, I had become very familiar with the festival in Moscow. We had taken a stand against the festival by

Mr. ARENS. May I interrupt? You are speaking so rapidly our reporter is having difficulty. If you would slow down it would be appreciated.

Mr. JONES. Because of the discussion and background and research that went into finding out about the festival in Moscow, I came to realize that this was an important international meeting, important not in terms of furthering international cooperation necessarily, but important in terms of attempting to bring and sway people into thinking about the Communist Party and joining the Communist Party. Then I realized, in the past, the delegations that had gone from the United States had prepared a picture which I, as an American student and as an American, did not feel really represented the whole truth of the American way of life.

For instance, one of the things which was brought out in one of the festivals which were held in the past-there were two things that represented the entire spectrum of the American system; one of these was a huge picture, a huge display of a very vivid lynching scene just that picture which I think could convey pretty well something about our system, but also there was another presentation which attempted to convey, and did pretty well, that the American working classes were working longer hours, were getting paid less, had no security in jobs in any sense. Many of them could not get jobs while their capitalist war dogs, who were exploiting these people for their own ends, were attempting to create a situation where there could be no international cooperation.

Mr. SCHERER. Do you know the source of that propaganda? Mr. JONES. It came from the delegations that purported to represent the Americans there at the festival.

Mr. SCHERER. From our own?

Mr. JONES. I would put Americans in quotations because these Americans, in fair analysis, would have to be termed sympathizers of the propaganda line, are very hard-core Communists. I could not say about their affiliations.

Mr. SCHERER. They were delegates from this country?

Mr. JONES. They took it upon themselves to go.

Mr. SCHERER. They were people or persons from the United States? Mr. JONES. Yes, sir.

Mr. ARENS. This was material you read in advance of your own trip to Vienna, was it not?

Mr. JONES. Yes.

Mr. ARENS. It was propaganda material you read advertising the Vienna festival or telling about other festivals?

Mr. JONES. Yes. This could be termed propaganda. Anything really can be termed propaganda, but I got my information from many sources. One of them was a group called the Independent Services for Information on the Vienna Youth Festival, a group out of Cambridge, Massachusetts, which is financed by a private firm. This group attempted to get to the college campuses as much information about the festivals, the background of the festivals, the purpose of the festival, as they could to reach as many college students as possible, so those who did want to go to the festival could be very informed about what they were getting into, and this was not just a beautiful existence of coexistence, and people were not there just to meet and sing and dance. It was really a serious thing as far as the Communist Party was concerned.

Mr. ARENS. Did you, because of your interest in the festival, which was created by the propaganda leaflets you had seen and regarded as the misrepresentation of America in these festivals, determine that you were going to go and, as one American, attempt to find out what was going on and attempt, in your humble way, to make a presentation of the truth? Is that what precipitated your interest in going?

Mr. JONES. That is exactly what precipitated my interest.

I don't know if, in my humble way, I did anything at all; but I felt to have persons at the festival who were immuned, so to speak, to the line which was perpetrated there and to have persons who could attempt to present in a rational manner the facts, not only about our system, but to attempt to analyze the facts about the Soviet system or any system, and to discuss rationally with these people at this festival what we felt was important.

Mr. ARENS. In your training at the religious institution where you are training for the ministry, you have developed, have you not, a firm conviction against the Communist ideology and for the ideology of freedom as we understand it under God?

Mr. JONES. I would rather say this, that I have formed a basic belief in the divinity of man, and if this belief contradicts the Communist line and, so, happens to go along with the American way,