Mr. LUFT. Yes, sir. Mr. Nikkel, our Program Division Chief, is here. I am sure that 25 would relieve the most urgent ones. Mr. NIKKEL. Twenty-five would be ample to take care of the most urgent situations. It also would be pretty well within the capacity that we would have to do any kind of a reasonable job. Mr. WHITTEN. I realize I have done most of the testifying here. But, I have become convinced from my own correspondence, from the members of the legislative committee, and others that this subcommittee has an obligation to look into this. The law clearly contemplates that this insurance program be made available to people in all areas on the same basis and no provision was made at the instance of the Budget. I realize that you, Mr. Luft, and your staff were not free to come here voluntarily or to instigate or promote this request. You are here at our request, and the information we asked you for you are privileged to give. You came as a result of our own request. I thank you gentlemen. Mr. Natcher, will you take over, please? Mr. NATCHER. Mr. Horan? Mr. HORAN. I assume that your appearance here is largely one of getting ready for next year's crop year. Is that not true? Mr. LUFT. We were requested to come here before the committee and answer whatever questions were asked. I am sorry to say I do not know just how to answer your question. CROPS ELIGIBLE FOR INSURANCE Mr. HORAN. What crops would be eligible for insurance between now and when frost comes? Mr. LUFT. You are speaking of 1965? Mr. HORAN. I am speaking of 1964 crop year. Mr. LUFT. This crop year. Sales have closed on all crops. It is past the closing sales date for 1964. Mr. HORAN. What you are really asking for is a supplemental to get ready for next year? Mr. LUFT. Yes, this would be a supplemental for 1965. We are already selling 1965 crops in old counties. ADDITIONAL COUNTIES Mr. HORAN. You have petitions from 25 counties to be included? Mr. LUFT. Approximately. Mr. NIKKEL. More. Mr. HORAN. The door is open to at least a hundred. Mr. NIKKEL. We have requests actually from more than 25 counties; 25 counties would be the ones that are most pressing. Actually, as of August 31, our winter wheat sales for 1965 and winter barley closed in most of the country. Some counties sell as late as October 31. The preparation we could make now would be for insurance of 1965 spring crops. Mr. HORAN. You do not have money in the till to do the preliminary work to set up those? Mr. LUFT. Not in the additional counties. Mr. WIRIN. Mr. Horan, these witnesses are appearing at the request of the committee. There has not been a supplemental estimate submitted to the Congress. Mr. MICHEL. What is the total number of requests you have on hand now of additional counties? I Mr. NIKKEL. We have requests that would exceed 50 counties. might explain we have for quite a period of time now told our State people that we were not able to make any expansion to any counties in 1965 so they have been relaying this information to the groups in the counties that were interested in their State, telling them that perhaps consideration could be given for 1966. The request for the insurance normally first comes through our people in the State. They know the spots out there where the pressures are greatest. Mr. MICHEL. Where are the 25 that are most urgent? Mr. NIKKEL. There are two in Illinois and one or two in North Carolina. Then the most pressing requests probably would include 1 county in about 15 different States, on the basis of our records. CROPS TO BE INSURED Mr. MICHEL. The most urgent ones are for insuring of what crop; tobacco, wheat, corn? Mr. NIKKEL. Not wheat. Winter wheat would be too late and we have most of the major Spring wheat counties in the program. It would be the Spring crops in the Midwest-corn, soybeans. In the South it would be tobacco and cotton. CRITERIA FOR SELECTING COUNTIES Mr. MICHEL. What have been the criteria for qualifying the county to participate in the program so far as numbers of farmers in the county? Is there a standard or norm or minimum requirement of participating farmers in a county before it can be acceptable as eligible? Mr. NIKKEL. There is not presently. In this legislation in the past there was such a requirement. At one time it was 50 farmers. Later it was changed to 200 applications or a third of the farmers in the county, whichever was smaller. That was removed on the basis that we would go into counties where there was interest and we could have situations where administratively, from the standpoint of service and economy, it was practical to handle fewer than the 200 contracts. FARMER CONTRACTS Mr. MICHEL. Who does the initiating of this back at the county level? Do you actually have salesmen out pushing the Federal crop insurance? Mr. NIKKEL. Yes; we have salesmen who contact farmers and explain the insurance to them and take their applications. Mr. MICHEL. I understand out in my home State several farmers were rather disturbed by the fact that Federal employees were out soliciting business and so doggone insistent that they do participate. Is that supposed to be a pressurized sales job on their part? Or is it supposed to be voluntary among the farmers? Mr. NIKKEL. No, sir, none of our salesmen are supposed to pressure. Mr. MICHEL. I think that has actually been the case in several instances. Mr. LUFT. I would defend our salesmen, our employees working in the field. I have traveled in the field. I have investigated personally many of these cases. There have not been too many. When the premium comes due, a few people try to find an excuse not to pay their premium. They say that the salesmen misrepresented the program, that there was high pressure. This is a voluntary program. We are obligated under the act to inform the farmer of our program. Mr. MICHEL. To inform the farmer of what is available but not a Federal agent saying, "This is what you are going to do." There has been that kind of pressure brought to bear. I know it as a matter of fact. The basic program is good, I support it, we all do. That does not mean we have to pressurize people into participating in a program. It is like jamming a program down their throats when they voted against it in a public referendum and we in Washington legislate and say you have to buy it. I just wanted to put that on the record because I recall some instances of that coming to my attention in the past year. I think I even had to write a couple letters on it to make sure it was not happening again. Thank you. Mr. NATCHER. At this point in the record we will place a copy of the bill, S. 277. (S. 277 follows:) [S. 277, 88th Cong., 2d sess.] AN ACT To amend the Federal Crop Insurance Act, as amended, in order to increase the number of new counties in which crop insurance may be offered each year Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the fourth sentence of section 508 (a) of the Federal Crop Insurance Act, as amended (7 U.S.C. 1508 (a)), is amended by striking out "in not to exceed 100 counties", and inserting in lieu thereof "in not to exceed 150 counties". Passed the Senate August 28, 1963. FELTON M. JOHNSTON, Secretary. Mr. NATCHER. Mr. Horan, further questions? Mr. HORAN. I want to say that we on this subcommittee are very anxious that this program, which is the outgrowth of a failure at one time, it was reinstated as a sort of experimental job, with the expansion limited perhaps to the place where it affected the actuarial security. However, the bill passed, there was no opposition to it. I was not opposed to it. I hope that you will use caution and prudence in these expansions. You may recall that one time we had to remove some of these benefits from 14 counties in the Great Plains area, which is a rather arbitrary way to achieve that. The experience was there, I guess. That is all. Mr. NATCHER. Mr. Luft, we want to thank you and the members of your staff for appearing before our committee at this time. Baughman, J. S. Boutin, B. L___ LIST OF WITNESSES Brown, D. S__ Budge, H. H. Buhl, J. M.. Davis, H. P. Evans, Dr. F. B_. Luft, J. N__ McGuire, M. C‒‒‒‒ Nikkel, E. H_. Owens, H. F Ruttenberg, S. H. Schmidt, W. A.......... Slayton, W. L... Smith, S. R____ Turpin, W. P___. Vanneman, S. C............. Weaver, R. C---- Wirin, H. B.. Woodside, B. D---. Worthy, E. H__ B Page 48 170 1 17 110 122 48 48 110 110 122 110 17,48 1 48 48 1 96 80 96 96 80 17 170 48 170 110 80 110 1 17,48 110 170 48 122 1 122 17, 48 122, 170 110 110 |